10 – Tenons Anyone? – Mortise & Tenon Options

Video - February 2, 2007

With so many joints in woodworking, its sometimes difficult to know where to begin. But there is one joint that stands out in my mind as the first joint every woodworker should learn: the mortise and tenon. This is the joint that separates our work from Walmart’s. Are there faster ways to get the job done? Sure. But as woodworkers, with a focus on FINE woodworking, it’s our obligation to seek out the highest level of quality possible and to go beyond the “get ‘er done” mind set.

Discussion

Darryl February 2, 2007 5:40 pm

nice work, I like this episode. great work talking about alternatives without getting pulled off the main course of the discussion.

…and I really need to practice more (or should I say some?)…

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Jim Parent February 3, 2007 8:35 am

Just purchased a Steel City Mortiser and have very much enjoyed Part 1 for obvious reasons. Please get at Part 2………I need all the help I can get!!

Thanks…………..Jim

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thewoodwhisperer February 3, 2007 9:26 am

Hey Jim. What to you think of that Steel City unit? I have the Jet and am getting ready to upgrade to the Powermatic. But I am very interested in hearing what people think of Steel City tools. Let me know.

Marc

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Tim February 3, 2007 11:00 am

Another great episode! I think you should have touched on when to use each joint. For example if you use pocket screws where you will never see them than you won’t have to fill them in. In my opinion each type of joint has its use and knowing when to use one instead of the other can save lots of time and headaches later.

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Scott February 3, 2007 1:27 pm

Hey, I feel slighted! Just watched the episode. What’s the deal with the repeat T-Shirt?

OK, really. Another great episode. Had another epiphone today. That picture in your banner of you at the tablesaw is in DJM’s shop, isn’t it?

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thewoodwhisperer February 3, 2007 2:22 pm

I wore that shirt before??? Crap. There goes my perfect record.

And that is indeed in David’s shop.

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Darryl February 3, 2007 9:54 pm

I thought I had seen that shirt before! I just havn’t gone back through past episodes to look yet.

I’m so glad it’s not just me noticing these things!

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Greg Watson February 4, 2007 4:25 pm

Hey Marc great episode, I especially appreciate seeing you demonstrate YOUR technique. I wonder if you would/will comment on the pros and cons of floating MT vs more traditional. I’m mostly interested in relative strength of one over the other and if there are certain situations when you wouldn’t use the floating one.

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thewoodwhisperer February 4, 2007 10:46 pm

Hey Greg. As far as Im concerned, the only difference between the floating tenon and the integral tenon is how you make them. Strength-wise, a properly milled floating tenon joint should be just as strong as an integral tenon. I would do whatever method is easier for you. But since a floating tenon requires you to put a mortise on each piece, you might run into some issues on long pieces (such as a long table apron). So unless you have a multi-router or something like the Domino, you will need to find a way to balance your router at the end of a long apron piece. Tricky stuff. So in those cases, I would absolutely recommend an integral tenon.

But otherwise, I consider the two joints equivalent.

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Scott February 5, 2007 4:55 am

I’ve had success with a shop-made slot mortiser. Mine is a variation on the one featured in FWW #174. I built my router table with a provision for mounting my plunge router horizontally. That horizontal attachment will bolt up to my slot mortising jig, which in-turn is fastened to the table.

There’s a lengthy discussion thread on it at knots (Fine Woodworking’s forum): http://forums.taunton.com/fw-k.....redirCnt=1 More details about my setup can be found in post #20.

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Scott February 5, 2007 4:57 am

Cripes! The link doesn’t work. This one should take you straight to my post: http://forums.taunton.com/fw-k.....g=32436.20

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Greg Watson February 6, 2007 11:43 pm

Marc; Just read an article in FWW #148 about M&T strength. The author likes floating tenons and said “…all the joints we tested were stronger than the most severe load they would ever be subjected to…” but “…if faced with a need for a super-strong joint or one that must not deflect, I will now use a traditional mortice and tenon…” once again your advice is right on the marc ;-) Greg

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Newbie February 7, 2007 11:02 am

If a mortiser is nothing more than a drill press with a chisel, why have both a mortiser and a drill press? Do manufacturers not make a duel-purpose machine? And if not, why not?

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thewoodwhisperer February 7, 2007 11:11 am

They do make add-on kits for drill presses that will allow you to cut mortises. But it is my understanding that its a real pain in the butt to tear down and set up. And the results are usually not as good since the drill press table is not intended for the type of work required for drilling mortises(for example, the absence of a built-in fence). But if you are limited on funds and space, there is no reason why you couldnt use this type of system.
Just like many other multi-purpose machines, it will be a jack of all trades but a master of none.

marc

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John Van Hoesen February 11, 2007 2:24 pm

Just wanted to suggest another method for making the tenons using your router table. Marc and I had a brief discussion about the merits of either and I think we agree that it comes down to what you learned and what you use most often. I find that using a 1/4 or 3/4 straight bit (depending on the size of the tenon) on my router table (using the exact method that Marc uses on his table saw with a stop block) is faster than either using my table saw with the thin blade or tearing down and putting in a dado blade. Once the stop block is set, you can run through as many tenons as you need. Just another alternative to the many ways that Marc has shown.

Thanks again for the great episode Marc!

J~

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jack August 17, 2009 5:37 pm

what size hose connects to the dewalt router?

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- thewoodwhisperer August 17, 2009 6:08 pm
  
  I think its 1 1/2″ but don’t quote me. It fits a small shop vac hose nicely.
  
  Reply
  - jack August 17, 2009 6:33 pm
    
    thanks I will be receiving it tomorrow.
    
    Reply
jack August 17, 2009 8:19 pm

when you set up a router bit do you push the bit all the way to the back of the collet or do you back it out a little.

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- thewoodwhisperer August 17, 2009 8:22 pm
  
  I always back it out a bit. Never bottom out a router bit.
  
  Reply
  - jack August 17, 2009 8:48 pm
    
    thats what i thought but my teacher told me the always go as far back as possible. lol
    
    Reply
alex corsi December 9, 2012 6:10 pm

i’m making a screen door for a christmas gift and needed to learn motis and tenons. never done them before, hope they go well. thanks for teaching me

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Toby November 26, 2013 4:16 pm

I know this is an older video but hopefully you will see my question. When you speak of relative dimensioning, do you do that for every tenon? I’m thinking about a project with approx. 50 joints. This will be my first project with mortise and tenon joints. By the way, love you videos. Whenever I google a woodworking problem, your site comes up and gives excellent advice.

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- Marc Spagnuolo November 27, 2013 7:20 am
  
  Well, relative dimensioning can be done to determine the size of a tenon, initially. From that point, all of your tenons should be the same since all of your mortises are likely the same. When you are talking a LOT of joints, you have to come up with ways to batch them out accurately since fitting each and every joint isn’t practical.
  
  Reply
Tony March 13, 2014 9:49 am

I am looking to begin the process of creating some proper joints and think that using the router seems like the best way for me to cut my mortises. So now I need a proper plunge router, fence and bushings. Do you have any recommendations? I want this to be a tool that I can get great results with and have for a long time but can’t quite justify a Festool yet.

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- Marc Spagnuolo March 16, 2014 7:51 pm
  
  To be honest, there are many brands that will likely satisfy your needs. Look into the DeWalt, Porter Cable, and Bosch combo kits. They come with two bases and usually an edge guide. You can pick up a nice set of guide bushings from just about any vendor: http://www.amazon.com/gp/produ.....dwhispe-20
  
  Reply
damawn May 11, 2014 6:01 pm

“I’m ready!!!…” LOL.

Great episiode!

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Chad January 12, 2015 4:45 pm

I am fairly new to woodworking but I have been following your blog for a few years, I love how you don’t miss a step.

I don’t like to do anything half way, so my first project is a very large dining table made of walnut. I am part way through the project and thinking about how to attach the legs to the apron.

My legs are made of 4 1/2″ X 1″ beveled stock glued up in a square, the important take away here is the center of the legs are hollow with about 2″ of hollow space in them. The side apron is about 3″ wide by 1 5/8″ tall and the end apron is about 2″ wide by 4 1/2″ tall, the side apron will not be visible.

Now to the question: I have thought of several ways of attaching the side apron, originally I had thought of a sliding dovetail but since the legs are splayed it was making that rather difficult for me to wrap my head around. I was then going to use a haunched tenon, filling the void in the table legs a few inches deep with face laminated stock, mdf or something that would help hold it all together. Given the scenario I have laid out does anyone have any suggestions on the best way to tackle this problem?

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- Marc Spagnuolo January 14, 2015 4:51 pm
  
  Personally I like the idea of filling the leg with stock. You want to be able to take advantage of that full leg thickness with an appropriately-sized tenon. So filling it would be the best way that I know to accomplish that. Then you can treat it like a solid leg and mortise accordingly.
  
  Reply

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10 – Tenons Anyone? – Mortise & Tenon Options

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