63 – Gadget Station (6 of 12)

Video - September 14, 2008

Now we’re really getting into the meat of the project. I show how to create a jig for the hinge mortises. I also cover the joinery being used to connect the legs to the case. I finish up by cutting the dados and rabbets in the case sides, and show you just how imperfect our machines can be. The router plane saves the day!

Discussion

Midnightcarver September 15, 2008 1:37 am

Marc you’ve been busy ! I have to catch up on all the vids! Very cool !

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Jeroen September 15, 2008 4:15 am

Hello Marc,

Why didn’t you measure the distance between the end of the router and the routerbit. This way you don’t have to make guess holes freehand and then go back to scribe a line.
On my router I measured the distances between the end of the router on all four sides and the hart of the routerbit. And wrote it on the router grondplate so the next time I need to make a hole I can directly measure the distance of the stops and not have to make practice holes al the time for the distance between the stops.

Keep up the good work :)

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Luke, Chippewa Falls, WI September 15, 2008 7:44 am

Sweet video and you sure excel at taking the time to set up right and doing it right the first time. I fall short there and get in too much of a hurry to start milling, cutting, or drilling.

I do have a suggestion from watching your video. To improve upon your jig a little bit, maybe you should cut a little sawdust relief rabit in the area where the jig, workpiece and router all make contact. I notice when routing and sliding the router back and forth you were building up a bit of dust there. With such precision work I would imagine the little bit of saw dust that may prevent your router from making full contact with the jig would make all the difference in the world.

I am so very new at this and it is cool to be able to actually see stuff like this now. My philosophy in learning to understand rather than memorize. These videos are really helping me to do that.

Thanks Marc!!

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runningwood September 15, 2008 9:18 am

This was a truly enjoyable TWW episode and you know why…. Lots of action- I counted 4 different power tools and even some hand tool action, nice.

To comment on what Luke said above, if there is good contact between the router and the wood to start, then sawdust should not enter that space and it is really not an issue.

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thewoodwhisperer September 15, 2008 9:59 am

Jeroen- You will find that I am not a very big fan of measuring anything. :) I like getting my marks directly from the work itself, whenever feasible and sensible. In this case, I need to do some test runs for the hinges anyway, so it was convenient for me to do it that way. But there is certainly no reason someone couldn’t measure and build their jig that way. All personal preference really.

Luke- I agree that would certainly be an improvement on the jig. Fortunately, this time it wasn’t necessary. I ran a few test cuts and the dust just never became a problem. And here’s another interesting fact. Not sure if this is the case on all routers, but the baseplate on my Festool OF1400, is slightly smaller than the body of the router base itself. So as you push it up against the jig, there is a small relief area where any wayward dust can go. This essentially accomplishes the same thing (to a slight degree) as a small rabbet places on the bottom of jig stops. But I lucked out on this one because the dust pretty much stayed put. But, it really never hurts to include things like that in your jigs, IF you can remember to do them before the dang thing is glued together. lol

Thanks Runningwood. I was hoping you were going to say the reason it was so enjoyable was because I “look so buff”. lol (sorry everybody, chat room joke).

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Claude Stewart September 15, 2008 10:50 am

Marc, Is that buff or Buffy? Claude

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thewoodwhisperer September 15, 2008 10:57 am

Well Claude, if you see me as an attractive young blond, I think you might need new glasses sir. ;)

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runningwood September 15, 2008 11:01 am

its amazing what the camera can do to some people !

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Claude Stewart September 15, 2008 11:04 am

Oh I forgot I like a lot. Claude

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Shannon September 15, 2008 12:35 pm

Marc,

Great episode. It was interesting to watch the final product compared to watching you film it from the chat room. I love that Veritas router plane and I use mine a lot. Great tip for beginners and veterans alike about not measuring the case sides but instead marking from the existing marks. I need to remember that myself.

Reply
Germain September 15, 2008 1:02 pm

A router plane? “The Schwarz” is strong with this one…

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william swick September 15, 2008 1:14 pm

Hi Marc

I like this vedos on your gadget station, i have been watching them from the beginning. That dado tool, where might one fine that little tool.

Thanks

Reply
thewoodwhisperer September 15, 2008 5:07 pm

Funny Germain, lol.
William, that particular plane is from Lee Valley. Here is the link:
http://www.leevalley.com/wood/.....38;p=52609

Reply
David (runningwood) September 15, 2008 5:38 pm

Marc, can you explain how you set the depth of the router plane. In other words do you reference off the start of the dado ? I doubt you measure. What is your reference depth ? I guess it is not that crucial as long as you are consistent

Reply
thewoodwhisperer September 15, 2008 5:58 pm

Sure thing David. In this particular instance, I set the depth using the deepest part of the rabbet. The dados for the shelves were cut slightly high, intentionally. And most of the rabbet was in good shape as far as consistent depth. I just set blade and run it across the rabbet and look for the lowest point (very obvious with the blade in a fixed position. Then just set the blade down on the surface, tighten the nut, and plane away. The results are exceptional! And you are right, the actual depth is not so important as consistency across all the joints.

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TJ September 15, 2008 6:21 pm

Thanks again Marc, really enjoy the way you present your shows, … hmm i bet you own an Atari T-shirt :)

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Wilbur Pan September 16, 2008 1:22 pm

Nice job on the video as always. Now that you’ve seen what a router plane can do for the bottom of a dado, it won’t be long until you won’t be worrying as to whether your table saw blade will give you a glue line joint. You’ll be whipping out a hand plane instead. :@)

Serious question: what kind of Forstner bit was used for cutting the recess for the hinge?

Reply
thewoodwhisperer September 16, 2008 1:40 pm

That was a Freud bit Wilbur. From a small set of 5 or 6.

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Kip September 16, 2008 6:42 pm

Excellent episode Marc, I think the most informative so far on this project.

I think these video’s are your strong point. So, please keep up the good work.

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thewoodwhisperer September 16, 2008 6:44 pm

Well there goes that exotic dancing career I was banking on. ;) Thanks Kip!

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DeGauss September 16, 2008 8:49 pm

One question on the router plane, how would you sharpen the blade?

Reply
thewoodwhisperer September 16, 2008 9:01 pm

Very very carefully. lol. The blade actually is held in place with a little screw and you remove the head for sharpening. I’ll let you know how it goes after I actually sharpen it for the first time. :)

Reply
JT September 17, 2008 1:01 am

Marc,

That’s a pretty cool plane! Never knew something like that was out there. I also never thought of that type of inconsistency in dados as you always here of a “true flat bottom cut.” Makes me think twice before I glue up now. But for $150 for that particular plane, what other type of alternatives would there be to achieving the same results??

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Frank September 17, 2008 8:14 am

Once again, this was a great episode. Personally, I have had really good success in mortising when using the combination of a centering alignment pin, brass set up blocks, and a spiral router bit.

The centering alignment pin looks like a cone shaped router bit without a blade. Instead of using the actual router bit to set up my router, I use the centering pin. That allows me to concentrate on the center of the cut by aligning the point right on layout line. This can be done extremely accurately. The edge of the cut will take care of itself since it is determined by the size of the router bit.

I donâ

Reply
Matthew Hills September 17, 2008 10:57 pm

New question of the week: how come you have a Star Wars t-shirt that still looks like its in reasonable shape? anything of mine from that era has pretty much either composted in the back of a drawer or turned to cheesecloth in the washer.

Reply
thewoodwhisperer September 17, 2008 11:05 pm

haha. Good observation sir. That is simply a reprint of the original. Fortunately, t-shirt companies have caught on to the fact that geeks like me haven’t changed. We just got older and have no problem going into public wearing that same shirts we wore 20-30 years ago. lol.

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Tom B September 19, 2008 7:05 am

Hey, Mark,

Good info, as always.
One thing, though : we use Soss hinges pretty frequently in our
cabinet shop and Soss ™ does make dedicated jigs for both
the mortise and relief. Might be worth looking into if you start using
these hinges with any regularity.
For occasional use, though, I like the jig you made. Thanks for showing the setup for it….it’ll certainly help the wallet.

Reply
Greg September 20, 2008 12:26 pm

This was fantastic instruction, but then again what should we expect?

Neat Router plane procedure etc.

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Jorge Monclova September 20, 2008 12:30 pm

This episode is more like it. Great episode Marc, looking forward to the next one.

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BarryO September 20, 2008 7:35 pm

Marc,

‘hate to do it, but I have to take issue with your use of the rip fence as an indexing surface when you were doing those dados. Using the miter gauge and the rip fence simultaneously is very risky, especially when using a dado head. An experienced operator with careful technique (e.g., you) can avoid a nasty kickback, but showing it in an instructional video, without a “kids, don’t try this at home”, is not the wisest thing to do, IMHO.

Reply
thewoodwhisperer September 20, 2008 10:25 pm

No problem Barry. You are always entitled to your opinions on safe practices. And no one should ever do ANYTHING they feel is risky or unsafe. But I definitely disagree with you on this point. Using the rip fence simultaneously with the miter gauge is indeed very risky when doing a through cut. The off-cut can, and most likely will, get wedged between the fence and the blade. But not so much with a non-through cut such as a dado. The work piece is completely supported through the entire cut, holding the board securely perpendicular to the rip fence. As far as I’m concerned, this cut is no more dangerous than any normal cross-cut that you might make with your miter gauge. In order for a kickback to occur while making this dado, the workpiece would have to twist out of position or move horizontally on the table. Fortunately, we have the miter gauge and the rip fence helping us prevent that from happening.

Another thing to consider. Most after-market miter gauges come with very handy built-in stops. How is making a cut using the built-in stop on the left of the blade any safer than the cut I did using the fence as a stop on the right?

As an experienced operator who generally does pay close attention to safety practices, I stand behind the fact that this is a perfectly legitimate and safe procedure. Well, let’s just say its no more dangerous than any other tool in our shops. A certain degree of risk is inevitable. But I think many folks have it burned into their consciousness that miter gauge + rip fence = DANGER. And you know what, in many cases that is true so its not a bad thing for that to be the case. But in reality, there are exceptions to that rule, and I honestly feel that dado cuts are one of them.

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BarryO October 13, 2008 8:42 pm

Well Marc, I guess we’ll have to agree to disagree.

The case of the miter gauge with the built in stop is *not* the same as using the fence with the miter gauge. With in the first case, the stop moves with the miter gauge, so the workpiece is not sliding against it. And that is the risk with the second case; namely, that the workpiece wil “catch” as it is sliding on the fence, get a little cock-eyed, and then contact the back of the blade. It is tricky to maintain the right amount and direction of pressure on both the miter gauge and the fence in order to avoid this.

If the piece is long enough front-to-back so that the fence would serve as a reference edge, just use the fence. No need for the miter gauge. If it isn’t, then use the miter gauge itself to guide the work. I’ve seen David Marks use both at the same time on his show, and I wince when he does it. Others have commented on it on Woodnet, also.

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- Jay March 10, 2012 8:37 pm
  
  I’ve gotta say I’m with Marc on this one.
  
  Reply
- Byrdie June 17, 2012 5:55 pm
  
  I’m with Marc on this as well. Since the dado is not a through cut, using the rip fence as a stop presents little to no hazard. With the work piece being held firmly against the miter gauge there should be any “catch” on a good, clean, well maintained fence.
  
  Reply
Jeremy Crawford March 14, 2014 9:09 am

Marc,
I know this was a long time ago. But 2 questions concerning the hinges. How did you know what size straight bit to use in the router? And how did you decide how deep to go? It looks like in the video that you didn’t make them flush with the top of the hinge.

Reply
- Marc Spagnuolo March 16, 2014 7:55 pm
  
  All this information is attained from the hinge itself. The bits match the hinge dimensions as does the depth.
  
  Reply
Bryan October 11, 2014 11:24 am

Hello Marc,

I know this is an old post but I recently discovered your site and am proceeding to watch all the videos in order. Great site by the way.
At the time you made this video I had just over 10 years of woodworking experience and I saw a few things I had some questions about.

1) After you did the dado cuts you then proceeded to use a router plane to level out the dado bottom. Is this something you normally do and if so why? I have been doing dadoes for many years and have never once had to go to a router plane, or any other device, to level out the bottom. I always just ran the piece back over the blades and I have never had a problem with loose joints. Was there a reason you didn’t rerun the piece back across the dado blades, especially when you consider you were using the fence as a reference guide?

2) My other question was why did you start the rabbet cut on the router so far down from the end? I understand you were doing a stop rabbet but by starting so far down you left a decent amount to still be removed on the far side of the bit. After your initial cut did you feed the board the wrong way slowly inching towards your stop point? Or did you reinsert the board higher up close to your stop point? I always start just a shade down from my stop point and then feed the whole length. Inching back the wrong direction towards the stop point is exceedingly dangerous as the board can be ripped out of your hands, which I believe I saw you demonstrate not to do that in a previous video.

Not trying to knock your way of doing things but I consider myself a student of this craft and try to keep an open mind and always learn something new.

As for the miter gauge being used with the fence I feel something needs to be cleared up about this. Is it dangerous? Yes and no. If the fence, blade and and miter slot are all set up parallel to each other then there is nothing wrong with using the miter gauge with the fence. You should be using the fence as a reference point but the pressure should be on the piece holding it tight to the miter gauge to prevent movement. If you are pushing the piece into the fence and then trying to use the miter gauge to move it into the blade you are asking for trouble, don’t do that. Also never use a miter gauge and a fence together if you yourself have not personally checked if everything is parallel. Most times when there is a kickback using this combination it is because the fence is angled slightly into the blade and this will 100% of the time create major issues.

I myself regularly use the miter gauge and fence in unison and have never had a problem. I

Reply
- Marc Spagnuolo October 11, 2014 1:06 pm
  
  Hi Bryan. Keep in mind this video is about 6 years old at this point so I had to skim it myself just to refresh my memory. :)
  
  1 – I do. The explanation of why was actually covered extensively in the video. It’s not a question of loose joinery but flat bottoms. Again, re-watch the video at about the 16 minute mark for a full explanation.
  
  2 – You might want to take a closer look at the design. The rabbet stops a good distance from the bottom of the case. The amount left for chiseling was probably 1/4″-3/8″. So there was no need to route a second time and I completely agree about the dangers of climb-cutting.
  
  Thanks for watching!
  
  Reply
Jordan April 25, 2017 10:20 am

Your drawing of the saw reminds me of a monsters eye.

Reply

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63 – Gadget Station (6 of 12)

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