Life Without A Tablesaw?

Article - March 17, 2012

After reading this article from Fine Woodworking today about California possibly being the first state to enforce “SawStop-like technology”, I started to wonder about the future of tablesaws. Even before this whole SawStop debacle, the tablesaw was seen as one of the most dangerous tools in the shop. Now that our government is very close to forcing manufacturers to implement a new safety device, you can’t help but think about what life would be like without the tablesaw. Perhaps SawStop’s fear-mongering campaigns (see left) worked a little too well and you decide that owning a tablesaw just isn’t worth the risk, flesh-detecting or not. After all, even SawStop can’t stop what seems to be the most common tablesaw injury: the kickback. Curious about how dangerous a kickback can be? Watch this! Or perhaps you are a “Don’t tread on me!” type and you’d rather go without a tablesaw than to use one with new government-mandated safety features. Either way, there really is no better time than now to think about how one might survive in a post-tablesaw world.

Now don’t get me wrong, I LOVE MY TABLESAW, and mine isn’t going anywhere any time soon! I use it on just about every project. It also has a flame paint job and as a result, it is probably the coolest tool in my shop. But given the current state of things, it would certainly be an interesting exercise to think about how we might otherwise accomplish some common tablesaw tasks. And before you knuckle-dragging Neanderthals (said with love) start throwing rocks at me, I do realize there are hand tool equivalents for every tablesaw task. I can also ride my bike to New Jersey and back but I’d rather take a plane – RIMSHOT! So what I’m really looking for are alternative methods that are just as fast, just as clean, and just as easy as their tablesaw equivalent (and that doesn’t exclude hand tool methods). So I’ll throw out some ideas below as a discussion starting point, but what I really want is to hear from you guys. What tasks would you find hard to do without your tablesaw? Or maybe you have some obvious solutions that might benefit others. Share ’em with us!

Rips

Nothing rips a board quite as easily and cleanly as a tablesaw. And nothing in the shop can launch a board into outer space with as much gusto as a tablesaw! Consequently, this is something I already use my bandsaw for. Far too often while ripping long boards, I notice the board cupping in on itself. If it weren’t for my riving knife, I certainly would have experienced numerous kickback events. At the bandsaw, the cutting force is applied downward into the table surface, so even if the wood warps and pinches the blade, it will NOT fly in your belly or face. The safety benefits here are unquestionable. But what about cut quality? Most bandsaw blades will leave a rough edge. The blade may also drift during the cut drawing your workpiece away from the fence. Any thoughts on how we might overcome these two issues? For sheetgoods, look no further than the circular saw. Outfitted with a good quality blade and a nice clamping tool guide, you can make some seriously high quality rips in plywood. You could also take it to the next level and pick up a tracksaw!

Cross-Cuts

Whether you use a miter gauge or a cross-cut sled, the tablesaw is incredibly well-suited for cross-cuts. But what else could we use? For smaller boards (and if you don’t have a lot of cuts to make), a hand saw seems like a perfectly reasonable alternative. You might need to clean up the edge afterwards, but if you own a decent hand saw you probably also own a hand plane and a shooting board. Of course the miter saw is a good alternative for cross-cutting narrower boards too. A circular saw and a track or other guide could certainly be used for wider boards. If you don’t mind a rougher cut, you could also use a jigsaw. And while the bandsaw will work in some cases, I have never been a fan of using it for cross-cuts……maybe it’s just me.

Dados

The only reasonable substitute I can come up with for dados is the router. Even in a fully outfitted shop that includes a tablesaw, the router may very well be the preferred dado-maker. But when you are making cabinets and you have a bunch of dados and grooves to batch out, is there anything faster than a dado stack in the tablesaw? I am really curious to hear your thoughts on dados and grooves.

Tenons

The tablesaw is my go-to tool for tenons. Even as the proud owner of a Festool Domino, I still tend to make my tenons with a dado stack and a miter gauge. So one obvious alternative here would be the various “joinery systems” like the Leigh FMT, the DowelMax, and the Festool Domino. These are most definitely a “pricey” alternative but they work quite well once you live within their ecosystems. A more basic alternative might be to simply use the router table.

Miters/Bevels

For miters, which are essentially just angled cross-cuts, the miter saw is a perfectly reasonable alternative. That is, assuming you have a good quality blade and a well-calibrated saw. Bevels, or angled rip cuts, are a little trickier. We might be able to use the bandsaw with the table tilted at an angle, but we would still have all the same ripping concerns mentioned above. Additionally, we have the challenge of fighting gravity due to the tilted table. A circular saw and a guide can be used to cut a long bevel too, but on narrower workpieces this can be a precarious affair.

I am really interested to hear your thoughts on these common tablesaw tasks. What alternative solutions can you come up with and could you actually live without your tablesaw?

Discussion

Bob Daniel March 17, 2012 11:37 am

My tablesaw often doubles as a workbench, assembly table, or finishing table (small shop) so no, don’t make me do without it. I really really need it! And my table saw already has government mandated safety features: it’s electrically grounded.

Reply
- Mike Robertson December 5, 2015 11:07 am
  
  I have been using tools professionally daily for 20 years. I am the safety feature of my table saw. Knowing the physics of the blade eliminates the #1 table saw injury kick back. If the blade is set high the blade is pushing the wood downward the length of cut is short. When the blade is set 1/8-1/4 above wood most of the force is toward operator and length of cut is much greater. This lifts and bounces the wood causing both kick backs and cut fingers when you fight this. Using feather boards or board buddies keep your hands clear. Saw stop tech only saves you if your not using the tool correctly. I think it is cheaper to learn how to use the tool than to buy a more expensive (idiot proof tool) to set up to do table saws jobs with hand tools would also cost more than a delta table saw. On a similar note the two tools most responsible for eye injuries are a screw driver and hammer. So should we out law those tools or be safe when we use them. Most people I know that have been injured by tools had a lack of safety procedure. (5 chopsaw 2jointers 1tablesaw cut 2 bad kickbacks. 3 grinder ) only he jointer and grinder resulted in permanent loss. One of the jointers height adjusters broke while in use and the table suddenly dropped , adjusting the length of my ring finger, but this was not the jointers fault my finger should never have been where it was. So use any tool you want make sure to understand follow all safety procedures that go with the task and make sure your tools are in good shape.
  
  Reply
  - The Cobblers January 25, 2017 5:33 am
    
    Thank you for the words of wisdom! I’m in the process of setting up my first shop, don’t have a table saw yet :( Circular saw and track jig along with a router gets me by for now. I used a table saw in School 4 years ago, so if i did learn that blade phyisics info, i certainly must have forgot it! So thanks! much apprecaited
    
    Reply
  - Cj raced May 31, 2017 7:56 am
    
    Hi mike. I am a newbie….so are you sawing that when ripping a 3/4″ board….you leave the TS BLADE up high….like 2″? I have always heard that having the blade set to 1/8 of 1/4″ higher than the wood being cut? Thanks. Chris
    
    Reply
    - Dan November 12, 2018 1:17 pm
      
      For a circular saw, you and gravity are pushing down on the saw and the wood, so keep your blade just deeper than the wood. No fear of kickback. The circular saw will bog down before it will kick a board with high force.
      
      For a table saw, the higher the blade, the less its angle going into the cut will put the wood in position to kick back toward the operator.
Mark Lybrand March 17, 2012 12:18 pm

Regarding kickback, I recently helped a friend rip some 8/4x8ft red oak. He was not used to using a table saw or cutting that much hardwood at a time, and when he got excited, he lifted the wood too early, dropped on the spinning blade (I didn’t have the blade guard on) and the wood shot through an open door and landed in my living room about 30 ft. away. I had instinctively grabbed for the wood to try to keep from hitting the blade and I had a square fence to the blade, sharp blade and the resulting sharp edge gave me “paper”cuts to all my fingers. No stitches needed. My blade guard is as useless as teats on a bull so I never use it. (delta high carbon splitter rusts faster than I can clean and coat it). South Florida summers are brutal on metal due to humidity. I don’t blame others for my choices. I just don’t let my friends use my tools.

Reply
helen March 17, 2012 12:29 pm

I don’t have a tablesaw because of space issue in the small garage. Money is also an issue and I don’t want to buy a cheapie one from the big box stores. So, I just got a track saw and do everything with it. It’s probably a pain, but since that’s what I started with, that’s all I really know. All my cuts take forever to make but just learning to set up stop blocks, etc, I can get repeatable cuts. Since it’s just a hobby, I don’t mind spending the extra time for set ups. I just make do with the tools I have…router, bandsaw, and hand tools.

Reply
James March 17, 2012 12:48 pm

I don’t have a table saw either. Yesterday I experimented cutting tenons on a bandsaw. I was surprised by how well it worked. I just left the tenon a little proud of my line and used a chisel to finesse the fit. The real I problem I see with this method is when trying to cut a tenon on a longer board I think it would get a little unwieldy.

Reply
Mike March 17, 2012 1:04 pm

I got rid of my table saw (a Ridgid 10″) and even my 15″ planer and now only use hand tools. I got into it as a hobby and thought I needed all the power tools. Frankly, the table saw scared the crap outta me and my wife hated it even more. I’m slowing building my arsenal of hand-saws and find sooooo much more pleasure in working with hand tools. They’re much quieter, safer, and don’t need a dust collection system. Remember, it’s the journey, not the destination.

Reply
- thewoodwhisperer March 17, 2012 1:15 pm
  
  Hey Mike. Let me apologize for the following as it may seem like I’m picking on you. By no means is that my intention, but your last comment is sending my brain off on a tangent.
  
  I have heard lots of folks say something similar concerning hand tools, the journey, and the destination and it always puzzles me. Whether you use hand tools or power tools, there is still an awesomely gratifying journey to be had. It just depends on which route you want to take and which path you find more pleasurable. As far as the destination goes, I think it is just as (if not more) important as the journey since without it, we are just making piles of shavings with nothing to show for it.
  
  That tangent aside, I commend you on going all hand tools. I could never do it personally, but I think its cool when people do.
  
  Reply
  - Jed March 20, 2012 8:02 am
    
    Right now I have access to a pretty extensive woodworking shop, but that might not always be, and I might not have the money or space for power tools. Have you ever read anything about the long term effects of hand tool use on the body? Of course people have been doing this for a very long time, but it seems like it might lend itself to carpal tunnel or similar ailments (arthritis?) Or are these things that one might even face with power tools?
    
    Reply
  - JP March 24, 2012 3:02 pm
    
    I grew up learning with hand tools from my Dad and as I grew, learned the power tools. The Table saw is a versatile shop tool and most woodworkers claim it as their main shop tool of choice.
    
    1. Sawstop works to prevent your fingers getting cut or sliced up. The better solution is to not put your fingers that close to the saw blade. There are tons of jigs, push sticks, sleds that make this problem easy to solve along with learning proper technique. Common sense and safe technique are main tools in my shop.
    
    2. As for the journey or what I refer to as the pleasures of woodworking… Both power tools and hand tool woodworking provides the gratifying enjoyment of making a beautiful, useful project from wood. I have and still use both power and hand tools. Very often, Time is a factor and of course power tools rule in that case. I try to reproduce the project again when time is not a factor using exclusively hand tool techniques. It is more of a challenge, but handcrafted woodworking to me is immensely enjoyable and gives me another level of satisfaction and pride.
    
    3. My table saw gets less use every year. I don’t rip with the table saw anymore, I find my track saw is superior now that I built a vertical table for it. It is also my primary crosscutting method. Use the router for dadoes, dove tails, etc, it takes a bit more time on the router table, but it is cleaner and of finer quality… I use my compound sliding miter saw for most miters and bevel work. Table saw only gets used for the longer pieces that a miter saw won’t fit. For Tenons, I use the band saw and find it easy enuff.
    
    Would I get rid of my Table saw?? Hell NO!! But it is no longer my main shop tool.
    
    Reply
- Rick Barnes March 23, 2012 4:41 pm
  
  Got rid of my table saw too, and do most work with hand tools. I enjoy woodworking so much more now.
  
  Reply
- Christopher Hachet January 19, 2017 12:55 pm
  
  I am a power tool and hand tool woodworker both…I do a lot with hand tools.
  
  Reply
- John April 16, 2024 2:14 pm
  
  yeah, I’m with you. I have bought about seven English wooden jack/fore planes and love them. I simply prefer hand saws and wooden planes to machines. Just sold a drum sander for more space and now will list my 3 hp table saw. Eventually I’ll sell the 2 hp dust collector.
  
  Reply
Dyami March 17, 2012 1:07 pm

Not to be too brief here, but it’s a one word answer: No.

The table saw is one of the most used and critical tools in my shop. I, for one, will never go without one. I see woodworking with out a table saw similar to writing without a typewriter, word processor or computer.

Reply
- Christopher Hachet January 19, 2017 12:56 pm
  
  …Reagan wrote a lot of his speeches by hand…to each his own. that being said, a table saw is hugely useful.
  
  Reply
  - Joe December 20, 2018 7:49 pm
    
    Those trickle down economics really help you as a carpenter? Also, Regan didn’t write his speeches; Peggy Noonan did. I really am the millennial who made it; undefeated since 1989.
    
    Reply
    - Matt August 14, 2020 8:21 am
      
      lol best random comment i’ve read on the internet in a while
      
      biblethump
Micah March 17, 2012 1:43 pm

Super glad I ran into this discussion. Recently my cheap quality Black and Decker table saw took a permanent dump on me. I currently have no table saw and it might be a little while before I can justify buying one, being that I just purchased a Bosch router. Finding alternative ways to cut and rip are so good to know. I also subscribe to Wood magazine and they have some great skill builder tips on utilizing certain tasks when a shop is absent of the primary tool for that task. In Jan 2011 issue, they show how to make some table saw cuts with the Miter saw. As a beginner wood worker, my shop arsenal is not very impressive. Would we be able to do a list of tools to buy in order for woodworking as a shop grows? Power or hand tool. I know that everyone is a little different with what types of projects they work on. So I’m thinking of just a general list.

Reply
Joseph Watson March 17, 2012 2:00 pm

Since I have kids I went hand tools only because a lot of my time I get to do work is either during naps or at bed time. Power tools don’t do much to keep the wife happy when our bedroom is on the other side of a wall from my shop. I do all my joinery by hand and do some basic dimension work on the tablesaw, but I am working to get to a point where I can even do that by hand. I still thickness with a thickness planer but I don’t use my jointer anymore. I dont plan on losing the planer though.

Having said that I don’t even recommend it for everyone it is a lot of work and its on average slower but you can learn to work pretty fast if you learn how to manage your workflow.

If you really have a desire to get rid of a tablesaw replace the machine with other machines that do the same work. For example a bandsaw can do the ripping and a mitersaw can do the cross cutting. Doing a lot of work with sheet goods then build or buy a panel saw. You can also do that work with a Circular saw.

I disagree with Dyami on one point you could always write with pen and paper, carve into clay tablets or paint on cave walls :D

Reply
- Jack R March 31, 2012 10:28 am
  
  Great topic and discussion.
  
  I learned to used power tools from my grandfather and middle-school shop class over 20 years ago. I thought the best and most versatile tool in the shop was the table saw. I have an older Craftsman contractor saw I modified into a large workstation with an after-market fence, added dust collection, and the MicroJig splitter – I have yet to have an accident and have a healthy respect for safety and the damage the saw can cause.
  
  My son is 7 years old and I am teaching him the craft – I will NOT let him use the TS yet though. I have been following your Podcast along with Matt and Shannon and have seen the value and use of hand tools in addition to the power tools.
  
  Recently my son was building a wooden cross with a center double half-lap joint. With my instruction, he cut the kerfs with a back saw in a plastic miter box, rotated the piece and hacked out the majority of the wood with a chisel, and then we finished up the cut with a router plane and shoulder plane. It actually took less time than setting up the table saw with a dado blade and he had fun.
  
  My eyes are beginning to be opened to how we can use both power and hand tools. They both have their place. I won’t get rid of the table saw anytime soon, but there certainly are ways to get the work done without it.
  
  Reply
Jason March 17, 2012 2:03 pm

Dtiched the table saw a while back. Getting back the space (I have a small ‘shop’) was such a boon it would have been worthwhile to give the damn thing away. That I got a couple of quid for it was all bonus.

For repetative, production work then it’s easy to see that the Table Saw (and the paraphanalia including space and dust collection that goes with it) is uesful. For a hobbyist… there are plenty of ways to cut wood.

Given the expense, dust, noise, danger etc etc I think the common narrative that says the table saw is a must have and the centre of a workshop is wrong. A table saw should be something that you add into your woodworking if you feel the need.

Reply
Rybo March 17, 2012 2:07 pm

Great post, and very helpful as I’m new to woodworking, and college kids like myself can’t always afford the more expensive tools like table saws.

I’m currently having to rely solely on hand saws, with the occasional table-saw owning friend to rip things for me. I’m interested in making my first major woodworking purchase, but in all honesty, table saws scare me. Does anyone have any advice on the best all around, relatively safe saw? I’m not against a table saw, just cautious and wondering if there is a better alternative right now.

On a related note, what’s the best way to clean up the end grain of wood that’s been cut with a rough hand saw?

Reply
- Steven Conwell August 28, 2016 10:36 pm
  
  I think a sanding block would work well on end grain.
  
  Reply
Vic Hubbard March 17, 2012 2:17 pm

I use the tablesaw a lot. But, for what I like to build I could easily be bandsaw concentric. With a well tuned bandsaw and a carbide blade, like the Resaw King from Laguna, cuts can be nearly as good as the tablesaw can make.

Reply
- thewoodwhisperer March 17, 2012 2:33 pm
  
  Love me some Resaw King! An aptly named product if there ever was one!
  
  Reply
  - Vic Hubbard March 19, 2012 10:05 pm
    
    I’m really happy with it now that I figured out it takes a completely different set up than I did for my Timberwolf blades. I use high tension on it and offset it from the center because of the teeth. I still managed to avoid any drift. Prior to this set-up it drifted so bad I couldn’t even compensate for it.
    
    Reply
    - fransikaner March 21, 2012 7:47 am
      
      Double Ditto on the RSK!!! It rules supreme and is one of Laguna’s core competencies.
MikeM March 17, 2012 3:27 pm

Great topic. Something I am surprised no one has mentioned yet is track saws. I know there are some woodworkers who use these as TS replacement. True, it can’t do everything a TS can, but if someone is limited on space this is a good alternative.

Reply
Will Stokes March 17, 2012 3:27 pm

Interesting conversation. Regard ripping with power tools, you could try to do it on a radial arm, although I hear that is *more* dangerous then doing it on a table saw. I’m quite happy doing rips on a table saw. :-)

Reply
James N. March 17, 2012 3:34 pm

I used to be all handtools – I almost gave up woodworking due to frustration.

Reply
John March 17, 2012 3:41 pm

I am on the “fence” (pun intended) of ditching my table saw. I do have the luxury of having a Festool track saw, and the Domino system. The only thing that is keeping the table saw in the shop is the ripping of long stock lumber. I do have a small 14″ bandsaw, but I am not confident in its ability to cut a repetitive straight line. I am saving up for a nice bandsaw (18″), but until then, I guess I have to keep the tablesaw. I would rather drop $1500 for a GREAT bandsaw, than $2500 for a SawStop. The other deciding factor is that I want to include my kids in the shop with me, and as previously mentioned, there is NO safety feature that is going to eliminate kickback in every situation on a table saw.

Reply
- John B. March 18, 2012 6:34 am
  
  I have no affiliation to a manufacturer, and I am sure that there will be some flames on this comment but…
  
  I have to disagree with the idea that “there is NO safety feature that is going to eliminate kickback in every situation on a table saw”. I have a Bosch 4100 contractors saw which I have used for the past 3 years for everything from 12x24x1/4″ picture frames to ripping down the 8/4×8″x8′ stock for the Roubo Guild Build. If all the safety devices are engaged on my saw I don’t see any way there could be kickback. the safety devices for this saw include a riving knife, hand guards and pawls off the back of the riving knife to ensure that the work piece, once engaged doesn’t go backwards towards the sawyer.
  
  If you want to discuss table saw usage without the safety elements engaged that’s a different story.
  
  Reply
- Christopher Hachet January 19, 2017 12:59 pm
  
  If I thought I could rip really well with something like a Laguna 14 SUV I would buy it over a table saw in a second.
  
  Reply
Olly Parry-Jones March 17, 2012 3:50 pm

I once bought a cheap table saw but never got along with it. After that, I bought a cheap bandsaw, learned to set it up correctly and used that for most of my ripping work, with a circular saw and straight edge to handle sheet materials.

About 18 months ago, I bought another table saw. The price was low but, this was a much better model than before. With a 16in bandsaw though, I just don’t use it enough and I now intend to sell it to free up some floor space. The only appeal I can see in it is that you can get clean bevel cuts, where a bandsawn finish will always need more work to smooth it. I have a sliding mitre saw for cross-cutting and I mostly use the router to cut tenons and grooves (dadoes).

That’s the great thing about woodworking – there is always more than ‘one way’ to achieve your goal.

Reply
bob March 17, 2012 3:50 pm

Slightly off topic — I spent two years at North Bennet Street School cabinet and furniture program. An awesome education. I wish today I had spent more time in the ensuing years in the shop – i have lost most of what I learned unfortunately. The point of this post is that in two years there, about 40 students at a time, some experienced woodworkers, some newbies. A full assortment of power tools. Bring/buy your own hand tools. In those two years, BY FAR the worst accident was done with a carving gouge. I don’t think it is far from accurate to say that student almost lost his finger. I don’t recall a single accident of substance in that time in the machine room. I am not saying that power tools, tablesaws or otherwise, are not dangerous — certainly they are. But switching to hand tools is not intrinsically safe, or even safer. I think many people let down their guard with hand tools and raise them with power tools. I am also thankful that I had some fantastic and practical training and rules about using all sorts of power tools drilled into me. Most (and me before I had that opportunity) of us buy a tool and use it. The manuals often have ridiculously restrictive directions resulting in essentially throwing them aside and ignored.

A table saw trick that needs a lot of hand work, a big shaper or a moulder for is cove cutting of larger radius’s than a router can handle. much flexibility. No matter the the government does, I am thankful I will be able to buy good quality user saws until I am gone!

Bob

Reply
- Ryan C March 17, 2012 9:49 pm
  
  I’m with Bob – the most dangerous tool in my garage shop is my flat-head screw driver. It’s the go-to for poorly-thought-out prying operations that can easily result in metal embedded in flesh. I think I let my guard down more with hand tools.
  
  For my brother, it was poor technique with a utility knife. While cutting towards himself, the blade ended up in his knee.
  
  Reply
Jeff Branch March 17, 2012 4:45 pm

I took a class at the University of Alabama called “Wood Technology” as an easy “A” – the class turned out to be a woodworking shop class. I greatly admired the large cabinet style table saw they had. When I was able to set up my own shop, my table saw quickly became the center of my work shop. Just me, but I would not be a woodworker without one.

Reply
Kirk March 17, 2012 5:02 pm

Watching that kickback video freaked me out. My next time in the shop, my guard was re-installed. I use my table saw mostly for breaking sheet goods, witch I am using less and less of lately. I have no plans to sell my tablesaw, but I have been thinking that a couple of MFT’s, a TS55 and a 1400 router would be just as useful for my workflow and have more useable and storable space. And added bonus would be that at the end of the day, the tables fold up and the saw and router are in neat boxes.

Reply
- Kirk March 17, 2012 5:06 pm
  
  forgive my grammer
  
  Reply
Steve Branam March 17, 2012 5:36 pm

I think the best combination of efficiency and safety for replacing a table saw is a bandsaw and hand tools. Personally, I like to do everything with hand tools, but I also realize that ripping is probably more than most people want to do by hand. It’s definitely the most laborious operation. So a bandsaw makes an excellent labor-saver.

A bandsaw gives a rip cut roughly equivalent to a ripsaw. Like the hand-cut rip, it can be cleaned up quickly with a jointer (you know, a #6 or #7 hand plane, not one of those spinny things!). While bandsaw ripping is slower than a table saw, it’s not that much slower, a reasonable tradeoff for the increased safety.

All of the other operations can be done with hand tools without too much effort. Crosscuts, dados, tenons, mitered or compound cuts. A few joinery saws and several specialized shooting boards, plus some chisels and specialized planes will get the job done. You can achieve very precise control with these tools, even for awkward cuts that have you really scratching your head trying to figure out with a table saw.

Reply
- Tony August 21, 2014 8:40 pm
  
  Unfortunately I hate my band saw, even bought a scroll saw for my more tedious small curved work. My table saw is so old that it did not come with blade guards or riving knife. I go to my table saw with the same respect that I ride my motorcycle with, give it the proper respect and try to install some after market safety features. I bought feather boards and even bought professionally made push sticks to keep my work flat and my hands clear of the blade. Since my saw was a contractor’s saw it really did not suit my purposes so I had to make a larger table which came out nicely for what I do in my shop. Now I do realize that the table saw is one of the most dangerous machines that we wood workers use in our shop, but I am with the other guys, I have had accidents with my screwdrivers more than any power tool in my shop because we do not respect those as we do machines with the power of a table saw. I will not give up my table saw even after I buy a better band saw, my chop saw comes in handy for repeated cross cuts but for smooth cuts I always turn to my table saw. And for you hand tool guys, I have done ripping with a hand saw, a straight line and a sore back afterwards, to me with my back problems it is just not worth it and my band saw is unreliable for a straight rip cut and I do not want to spend that much time on my jointer to fix all of the misalignment issues that I have using the band saw that I have.
  
  Reply
- Christopher Hachet January 19, 2017 1:01 pm
  
  Agreed on hand sawing for most work that requires set up. My table saw is sued mostly for ripping.
  
  Reply
james casey March 17, 2012 5:57 pm

I don’t think I could manage without my tablesaw .. I use it for all my projects and with a few jigs it is the most used tool in my shop.
However, I do see the dangers they pose. I have had a piece kick back once and end up out in my driveway, I consider that to be a lucky escape and since then I have bought a coupld of featherboards and they have made things safer in my mind. I was also thinking of buying a couple of magnetic featherboards .. had anyone tried these?

Reply
Eric F March 17, 2012 6:07 pm

I’m in the same boat as Joseph Watson. Having young kids with a basement shop and a wife that works every weekend. I’m lucky to get a 2-4 hrs of time in the shop during a week. I want to acquire more hand tools so I can do work when the kids are in bed.

I can see where the Festool MFT & TS55 can replace majority of functions you do on a table saw. I have a Ridged contract TS and would rather purchase a nice band saw instead of upgrading the TS.

Reply
Steven March 17, 2012 6:08 pm

First i would go underground an use it until they pryed it out of my cold dead hands just like my guns, then I would get a saw stop tech saw and move on because I wouldn’t want to work without my table saw but if I had to I would invest in a festool tracksaw and use my router table and sleds more of course it would be less efficient but if I had to I could do it, we all could if we had to.

Reply
- Jason March 22, 2012 3:11 am
  
  “First i would go underground an use it until they pryed it out of my cold dead hands…”
  
  Or what ever’s left of them -BADABOOM! :D
  
  Reply
Jim Woodward March 17, 2012 6:53 pm

Just not gonna do it…no way….no how. Definitely need the table saw. Now some day I will replace my contractor saw with a cabinet…at that point I might consider a saw stop. However regardless my shop will always have a table saw.

Reply
Dan Drabek March 17, 2012 7:14 pm

I worked for years without a table saw and did alright. But I have to confess to borrowing one from time to time for certain special tasks. Same thing with the band saw. Now that I have my own, I couldn’t imagine doing without them.

DD

Reply
Jim March 17, 2012 7:46 pm

Not having a decent, workable bandsaw (the benchtop one I have is pretty lousy and I’m very limited with what I can do on it); the table saw is really critical to my shop. Even when the time comes that I can get a decent bandsaw, I’m hard pressed to picture my shop without a table saw.

Reply
Dean in Des Moines March 17, 2012 8:27 pm

This is said partly tongue-in-cheek and partly out of ignorance… How about a radial arm saw?

Reply
- Joao Martins March 17, 2012 9:39 pm
  
  Real talk; Radial Arm Saw. It’s really versatile. For years, it was considered the most versatile tool, and a requirement in any shop. Miter saws have replaced the RAS’s most common use (cross cuts), but can’t replace nearly half of its total usages. Dadoes, cross-cuts, bevel cuts, slots, shaping, ripping, tenons, coves, drilling, planing, sanding…
  It might not be the safest solution for any or each of these cuts, but it is very capable and was the go-to stationary power tool before the table saw. I know that people might disagree, considering it doesn’t meet the modern safety standards for some of these cuts, but that’s no excuse for it’s lack of mention within this article.
  And on the note of “modern safety standards,” I can promise all of you that woodworkers 50 years ago didn’t expect us to have access to flesh-detecting technology… but we do! That’s what we consider cutting-edge safety (no pun). Imagine what “cutting-edge” safety might look like in another 50 years… such as letting a robotic arm perform the cut for you or a machine that monitors your eyes and limbs to determine if you are alert enough for the cut being performed.
  RAS… and you’ll be surprised.
  
  Reply
- Chris Wong March 18, 2012 8:41 pm
  
  Dean in Des Moines,
  
  If I did not have a table saw in my shop, I would probably had a radial arm saw for crosscuts, dadoes and tenons.
  
  Chris
  
  Reply
Steve March 17, 2012 8:44 pm

I had a cheap contractor saw for 10 years and it has seen very little use over the past 3 years do to my purchase of a Festool TS and MFT. But I have to be honest I just purchased a SawStop 3hp cabinet saw and I absolutely love it. I won’t ever go without a nice table saw again.

Reply
- James March 17, 2012 11:16 pm
  
  Steve I think you nailed it. There is a big difference between a cheap contractor saw or a contractor saw in general and cabinet saws. I live without a table saw because I don’t have the space, power or extra cash to spend on a good cabinet saw so its easy to justify not needing a table saw. If I didn’t have those limitations I would not even think twice about buying a cabinet table saw or a sliding table saw.
  
  Reply
Tom Finnigan March 17, 2012 8:45 pm

No way would I give up my tablesaw. In 30 years of using it I’ve never had a serious incident (knock on wood). ;) I respect what the saw can do to the wood and to my person so I am constantly aware of what is happening while using it. I live and work alone so I can’t take the chance of something happening to me while working and not be able to get help.

I lke the SawStop technology and would buy a saw with it if I could. Should I be forced to? No.

If all power tool owners use common sense and follow proper safety procedures most accidents could be prevented.

Reply
Bob W March 17, 2012 10:14 pm

Sure we *can* get along without a table saw but why? IMO all power tools come with a hint of danger. All very sharp handtools come with a hint of danger. Box cutters come with danger. Keep the table saw if you want. Get rid of yours if you want. Just don’t MAKE me get rid of mine because some think I MIGHT get hurt because they think I’m too stoopid to handle such a *dangerous* tool.

Reply
VitalBodies March 18, 2012 12:29 am

Nice Article Marc,

Pondering how to tool up the shop.
There seems to be different paths. Buy what you need as you need it. Create a shop and then work in it. Buy the right tools the first time or buy cheap then buy again. Power tools or hand tools or both. To name a few.
There is the take the project to the saw or the saw to the project ways of thinking and doing.
Some times I can’t help but to think we are in a build everything out of PVC pipe and duct tape kind of world when we should be using CNC machines instead.

There seems to be the build something once and move on types or the batch things out types and they each seem to have different needs. Pro vs hobby also.

In terms of the central tool of many shops, the table saw, I can see why people would be looking for the alternatives but the danger of them is number one followed perhaps by price and size. A quality table saw is often start in the $2500 range and then there are the countless attachments on top of that. Let’s put a $500 price tag on the attachments just for conversation sake.
So what if one thinks of it in terms of money? What else can one buy for $3000 that could replace a quality table saw?
Bandsaw and panel saw? Band saw and track saw? $3000 worth of hand tools like hand saws and planes and such?

When you think about Rips, Cross-cuts, Dados, Tenons, Miters and Bevels that is a lot of tool to replace. Large, small, hard wood, soft wood sheet goods, it really varies making tool choices a challenge.

Tenons, could one batch these out with a Festool track saw rather than make them one by one on the table saw?
Dados: Can that be done on a molding machine like the Woodmaster? Not likely that would be the choice for most dado applications.

Has anyone compared the danger of the cabinet saw with the sliding table saw?
At first glance, the sliding saw seems safer.
Below is an example: be sure to watch the short animation.
http://www.grizzly.com/product.....Saw/G0623X

Perhaps there should be a live without your table saw week every year.

Reply
Jarrid March 18, 2012 1:28 am

There are some REALLY great points made for both sides of this subject here! Not being an avid hand tool woodworker, I am gonna have to say NO. And probably will never reach the point where I can do without my table saw. It’s too invaluable. That being said I will say that I see some validity to such safety devices being produced.

I look at this subject through two sets of optics(so to speak). As a “noob” wood worker and somebody who has worked in an emergency room, I feel like the table saw is a necessary evil at times and look forward to the day when I am a bit more comfortable using one. I don’t ever wanna reach the point where I get too comfortable using one, because that’s when I will have a mishap.

As a “noob”, the table saw is invaluable to taking on projects that require cross cuts, dadoes, rabbets, etc. And while I know there are ways out there to complete the same tasks (hand tools, routers, etc.) but there are TWO things that make a table saw an obvious advantage:

1) TIME. Hand tool work is time consuming and takes a long while to learn to be proficient with them. While I hold ANY wood worker with such patience in highest regards, I simply do not have that kind of time. Routers and a router table can also be helpful, but take more time to set up and test cut, and when you are in a time crunch, a table saw is wicked simple to set up and batch out any pieces that need to be made. In the ideal world my trusted motto of “anything worth building is worth the time” would be followed to the letter, but let’s face it, it’s never gonna be an ideal world.

2) MONEY. To accomplish the MANY tasks you can do with a table saw with all the other tools out there requires some serious cheddar, especially if you buy quality tools. I would love to have cabinet full of quality hand tools that would do all the things I need to do in my shop, but until I have perfected my skills as a wood worker enough to do it for a living, buying said bevy of tools is just not an option. And for the price of a set of decent saws, routers and a router table, you are already spending more then the cost of a quality table saw that accomplishes those tasks efficiently.

Now for the other view…

As somebody who has seen and taken care of LOTS of people who have had shop injuries, I think the “flesh-detecting’ technology is a SUPERB idea. I just wish they could make this technology work for nail guns as well(which is the most prevalent shop/work site injury I saw in my days of ER). I am not sure about the whole MANDATE of it, but it’s still a great idea. For one state to go so far as to make it required is another of many superfluous quests(i.E. Prop 65 on any tools that contain brass or make dust). You can just as easily be injured by a router or sharp chisel which leads me to the conclusion that it’s the responsibility of the consumer to know their posterior orifice from a hole in the ground and JUST BE SAFE and not for any governing body to further pollute the current cesspool of entitled members of society, already filled with frivolous lawsuits over things that can be prevented by using your brain, with another venue to pursue moneys not rightful earned. Not to sound like a certain comedian but HERE’S YOUR SIGN!! Of course there are dangers with a power tool that has a razor-sharp, spinning serrated blade, DUH! If this technology was required on EVERY saw, we might as well be riding bicycles to and fro to prevent automobile crashes(which if you really think about it kills and injures more people then table saws)

In short, we should ALWAYS have a fearful respect of our table saw, but should NEVER throw it to the wayside because of fear or any governing act stepping towards “safety” or because our current saws are not equipped with such technology. Education should be parallel to the use of tools and be paramount for ANYONE who uses a tool of any kind. Like with so many other things in life, it’s BUYER BEWARE.

Reply
Mike March 18, 2012 2:14 am

For 25 years I’ve been using a DW1251 RAS with no issues doing ripping, cross-cutting, dados, mite cuts, etc. the only reason I bought a mid range TS recently was be because ripping tasks in a RAS is limited and causes too much flying sawdust and chips.
And after having the TS fir a couple of months now I actually find the RAS safer and less intimidating than the TS!!! I will still be using my RAS for alot of tasks, the TS will not replace it. My next purchase will be a Bandsaw and eventually I think the TS will just end up as a ripping machine only!

BTW I use a vertical Panel Saw for ripping large sheet goods!

Anyhow as I see it if you treat any piece of machinery with the respect it deserves it will treat you with the same respect!

Reply
Andrew March 18, 2012 4:08 am

I love the american style table saws which are gorgeous and can put to so many use. After a loooooog time of searching and waiting I grabbed on in the eBay (Chinese made and new). It looks pretty much like the laguna table saw ( comes with a riving knife). Its the best I have in my shop (hobbyist). About the regulation, I am not worried cos I live in the UK. As UK is soooo far behind the US in power tools, I guess it will take another 100 years for something like that ruling to turn up here, so I ain’t got nothing to worry about, just be careful.

Reply
Jim Davies March 18, 2012 4:54 am

Oh, I wish I had a table saw,
My cheap-o tools just slip and gnaw.
I spend my days finding lots of ways
To cut straight by hand which just delays
that perfect cut that will amaze.

Oh, I wish I had a table saw,
That perfect line I’ve learned to draw
evades the blades of all my saws.
Mitres too go down the loo
They just refuse to find the glue,
Leaving yawning gaps for all to view.

Oh, I wish I had a table saw,
But there’s not the space around my place,
and the price I face is a disgrace.
‘Worry not’ I say, ‘your mitre-box will save the day’.
Will it heck! and now it’s wrecked, chewed to death by cuts and splits,
I’m throwing tantrums, spits and fits.

Oh, I wish I had a table saw,
I’d take the risks with those cutting discs,
I’d risk my thumbs, perhaps my plums, to be the envy of all my chums.
‘Worry not’ I say, ‘my circular saw will find a way’,
I line it up with a guide, on some plywood far too wide,
And now I stand, just unnerved, surprised to find it cut a curve,
I tried it straight, but too much weight made it slip and slide, burn and swerve.

Oh, I wish I had a table saw,
rip saw, cross-cut, fret-saw, jig-saw,
tenon saw, scroll-saw, new saw, old saw.
I got them all but not the one that cuts so straight,
but I know I’ll have to wait.
I’ll try to learn that it is the man not his tools,
so off I go, back to school.

Reply
- jim j March 19, 2012 7:18 am
  
  Funny.
  
  Wordsworth your not,
  But laughs? A lot.
  
  Reply
Lenny March 18, 2012 5:29 am

This article has really got me thinking which happens to be one of the things I love most about woodworking. I have been trying to do everything on my table saw – exactly the opposite of the article. I never felt like it was any more dangerous than any other power tool as all power tools need to be treated with respect. I have seen just as many serious injuries from a router and when a circular saw kicks back it is not a board that flies in the air, but a spinning saw blade instead! It is good practice though to be versed in the use of other tools, just in casecthe unthinkable happens and my table saw is out of commission for a few days. BTW if they forced stop saw technology on table saws, why not on all other shop tools?

Reply
Jack March 18, 2012 5:49 am

I have an el cheapo Makita table saw and I love it. It is the most versatile tool in my shop.I’ve built many jigs for it to help make many different types of cuts safely. I think Saw-Stop is a great idea and if I could afford it I might even buy one, just for the extra peace of mind. But should the technology be mandatory on all saws? If this were the case I probably could never afford any table saw at all, greatly diminishing my enjoyment of wood working.

Reply
Jeff March 18, 2012 5:58 am

I am definitely of the ‘Don’t tread on me’ mindset. While I use my table saw less than I used to, I certainly don’t want to do without one. My solution to this garbage legislation is to save my pennies and by the best table saw of MY choice before I no longer have the right to.

Reply
Hans CHristopher March 18, 2012 8:09 am

Love the pic of you and the band saw. It is legen…wait for it…keep waiting…now…dary.

Cheers
Hans Christopher

Reply
Scottish Iain March 18, 2012 8:25 am

As a European following this debate through the WW and other sites as well as Fine Woodworking, i find the whole situation a bit baffling.
We’ve had riving knives and blade guards over here for years and the bottom line is, it’s a dangerous hobby/proffession and the person most responsible for your safety is you.
Asking people to use band saws and routers to do the job of a table saw seems to me to be inviting even more dangerous practices and may well result in even more injury. What then for the most litigious society on earth?
Sometimes, just sometimes it’s not everyone elses fault

Reply
George March 18, 2012 8:32 am

Love my tablesaw…not fond of proposed new laws but then changes for most of us are always difficult. Like when you got hacked and I couldn’t check in until today. I don’t know why but that was the case…also…now the photos don’t appear in your emails.
But, I just glad I got back into the site. Thanks.

Reply
Tom Iovino March 18, 2012 9:27 am

Well, this does mean that my 2002 vintage Ridgid 3612 will be worth more on the resale market!

An excellent point, Marc, about kickback. Until Sawstop prevents both blade contact accidents AND kickback accidents, there’s still plenty of opportunity for someone else to file a crazy lawsuit.

In my shop – with a track saw, band saw and jig saw, I have many options available…

Reply
Mitch Wilson March 18, 2012 9:38 am

I recently switched from a 30 year old contractor Makita TS to a General Intn. hybrid saw, and I am thrilled that I did. Rips are now easy and I plan on making a sled, once I put in miter slots on the Wood Whisperer assembly table that I built soon after getting the table saw. Also went with an Excalibur ceiling mounted dust collector/blade guard. This, and riving knife, are always used, unless the need for an uber-thin piece arises. Then along comes the G-R-Ripper. Actually, two. Essential and wonderful. For dados and grooves, I like my router table. I have this aligned with the TS and the assembly table, so that I can place dados and grooves in the middle of a four foot long carcase side with confidence. And a good router plane is always used to ensure constant depth. For really fine work, the Micro Fence is superb, especially for things like inlay borders. No table saw set up can make as refine a cut as the Micro Fence with its plunge base and a good palm router. I realize that all of this gets a little pricey, but I figure that my fingers and my eyes deserve it. And, maybe, so does my work.

Reply
Tom Collins March 18, 2012 10:51 am

Saw Stop is currently running a promotion (May 2012 WOOD issue 211) in which you can chose a free mobile base or overarm dust collector if you order by 4/30/12. Wood dust is a known carcinogen. If Saw Stop is so concerned about our safety, and not promoting their patented device, why wouldn

Reply
Wally March 18, 2012 11:39 am

Ok, first off, I am very passionately against all government control over peoples lifes and decision making. That said, I do not quite understand peoples problems with making tablesaws safer. Safer is better. The thing I do not understand personally, is why all tablesaw companies have not jumped on board with this. In the last 6 months I know of two people that had substantial injuries on the tablesaw. I see what Sawstop has done as an excellent advancement in technology and especially safety. I have a tablesaw, a delta contractor saw….except when I “can’t” use it, the guard is in place. No one can prevent people from being stupid or without regard for safety, but when someone comes along and invents something as, to me, profound as sawstop has, they should be applauded. I have really been needing to say this…thanks for a window of opportunity. Could I live without a tablesaw? No, I think it is a wonderful, useful tool, and I love mine (wish I could afford a cabinet saw though…maybe a sawstop?? Thanks, Wally

Reply
- Bob W March 19, 2012 9:17 am
  
  Wally – I am with you on government interference and I am for safer tools. However, the SawStop technology is really nice but expensive. I am not against making things safer. Like the rifing knife. Great invention and added feature to all tables saws. What I would like to see is that Mr. SawStop would lower his royalty price to make it more affordable to table saw mfg’ers. But to make that technology a government regulation, no way in hades would I ever be in favor of that.
  
  Reply
Ron March 18, 2012 12:15 pm

Are there other tools you could use to do the same jobs as the table saw does? Absolutely! Any job a TS can do there is a hand tool that can do the same thing. Woodworkers did it for hundreds of years before electricity was discovered.
(I’m going on a tangent here……too much WTO?) . Were there accidents then? Yes. Any moving object can be dangerous. Automobiles….TS….kitchen knives….even a hammer. Here I totally agree with Jarrid’s last sentence (post above).
EDUCATION! Learning how to use your tools along with a little common sense will dramatically reduce the chances of accidents (OMG! I sound like Norm). The way I see it, there are two kinds of accidents:
1) Ignorance: Not knowing how to use your tools properly.
2) HERE’S YOUR SIGN: Having been injured once doing something, then doing it again later and getting injured again. (I’ve done both).
COMMON SENSE is your most valuable asset. Would you stand in the path of an on coming automobile? No! Then why would you put your fingers or thumb in the path of a fast moving piece of serrated steel?? I could go on for hours about shop safety, education, and common sense and how ANYTHING moving and/or sharp can be dangerous if not properly instructed on how to use it.
Common Sense is that little voice in the back of your head that says, “Hey, Stupid. If you do it that way, your gonna get hurt.) LISTEN TO IT!
I’m 69 and have been a hobbyist wood worker since my grandfather took me to work with him when I was 10 or 12 (he was a carpenter) and I helped roof the house he was working on. I am proud to say I am a member of the “10 digit club” and have both eyes.
I guess what I’m trying to say is, if you are afraid of your TS, then you have not been properly trained in it’s use. Marc does a good job of explaining TS safety (look in the Safety section of Videos). But nothing beats a “hands on” course on TS use/safety (or any other tool) to get rid of that fear but still maintain respect for that tool. If we each had more training and used more common sense, there would be no need for “Saw-Stop” technology.

Reply
Matt March 18, 2012 12:40 pm

I’ve been following along this fiasco since the beginning…and yes I say fiasco because that is exactly what this has turned into (not this thread…the whole sawstop BS). I have been using a table saw as long as I can remember. I was trained to love and respect it by my grandfather…it’s how I was raised and how I came of age in the shop so to speak. I admit that I have had a close call or two, but who hasn’t? Do you not get into your car anymore because every time you do you take FAR more chances in bodily harm than when you use your table saw correctly? My biggest concern; like Marc’s is over kickback vs a cut, and as such I have chosen not to live my life in fear and to not buy into the SawStop fear mongering. I’m also lucky enough to have a wife that honestly talked me out of purchasing a SawStop when it came time to replace my old Grizzly cabinet saw. She has confidence in my decisions and actions in the shop and trusts that I will always have my game face on whenever I’m using any piece of machinery. I have absolutely no plans on ever giving up this key piece of equipment in my shop.

Reply
Jim Hutchison March 18, 2012 1:39 pm

I am with Matt. This seems to be a fiasco. Too much government over reach. I will not give up my Unisaw or try to work without it. That would be ridiculous. I have two young girls and a wife. I enjoy building things for them. If I spent all my available time trying to figure out how to work without my saw I would not get much accomplished. With two young children my available time is limited. I want to get in done and not fool around with alternate methods. I will keep my Unisaw, thank you. I want something to show for my “journey” (as Mike and Marc mentioned above) besides jigs and shavings.
Be safe and be productive.

Reply
jim zenner March 18, 2012 3:56 pm

I cant imagine working without it. I will admit i have done some pretty risky stuff with my saw but never had an accident. My saw is the center of my workshop like others have said it acts as a assembly table finishing table etc,etc. I will not give this thing up. I will admit when it comes time to upgrade sawstop is definately at the top of thew list. It’s quality, accurate and it could save a digit what more could you want in a saw?

Reply
CessnapilotBarry March 18, 2012 4:07 pm

Nope! Not giving it up…

I think flesh sensing, riving knife equipped tablesaw is probably SAFER than a band saw, miter saw, or track saw. I’ve taken the time, and spent the money, to obtain very good training on my tools.

Crap… did you ever see the injury stats for cordless drills?

Reply
Mo March 18, 2012 4:57 pm

I think Eleanor Everet said it best – For safety is not a gadget but a state of mind. This saw-stop is a great and useful invention that came to the table saws, but shoving it down someone one throat just to make any sense, now what would make sense if the manufacturer could offer you the saw with or without this technology. This will allow the consumer to make a chose to spend the extra money or not.

I think if the California government is going to force the California residence to get rid of their table saws and replace it with a saw-stop, I guess that says to much government interference to me. I love my Laguna table saw that is not going anywhere. If you use all you safety equipment – riving knife, guards,push sticks and follow the 3 inch rule you are cant go wrong. The gripper is also a very unique tools that is very helpful in the shop and keeps your hands away from the blade. I have read a interesting article on HandymanClub.com and this a portion of the article feel free to read the whole article at the link bellow. An then the business week article is also interesting to read.

From Handymanclub:

This saw is also a good choice for DIYers who want an extra margin of safety and can afford to pay for it. But the development of this safety feature has created a controversy: Because of a persuasive lobbying effort by the owners of SawStop, the patented technology that the company owns could become mandatory for all table saws. The Consumer Product Safety Commission (CPSC) is currently reviewing whether to make SawStop

Reply
- Wally March 18, 2012 5:13 pm
  
  I believe the Sawstop technology is acually quite cheap, considering. I believe, if one should have an accident with the sawstop and it crashes the blade, the replacement component is about $150.00 (+/-)…not including the blade of course…but….still much cheaper than the alturnative of losing ones fingers…and the following medical expenses that go along with it. Every body just be safe, be careful….or buy a sawstop!
  
  Reply
Wally March 18, 2012 5:17 pm

Forest’ mom said it best…”Stupid is as stupid does”

Reply
Jack March 18, 2012 5:45 pm

I don’t have a table saw, but I have access to a nice one. I use it very seldom, but I do use it.

I really miss the radial arm saw I had that was lost in a fire (a garage burned where it was stored during a move before a shop is re-established.

If we are going to go ‘all the way’, we need to have ‘Saw Stop’ technology on anything with a powered moving blade, or where the material is moved past the saw. This is ALL routers, power saws (portable and fixed), band saws (portable or fixed), circular saws, drills whether portable or drill presses.

I like the technology, but forcing its use is more big brother than not. There is also the argument (currently being made in my state) that adults should not be compelled to ware helmets when riding motorcycles. I don’t like that law either, but I would like an amendment that by NOT wearing one you have de-facto signed a full body donor card so if deemed ‘brain dead’ for over 2 weeks, your organs may be harvested. The motorcycle helmet law keeps down the cost to society from people that ‘loose’ in motorcycle accidents, but I don’t see as significant a benefit from the ‘Saw Stop’ law.

Remember, this is not just a mandate for the ‘rich’ or those that can ‘afford’ the technology. It raises the barrier to entry for those that would like to use wood to put people desiring to use wood in a production mode small shop to be able to feed their family.

Ok, the point may be slightly overstated, but I don’t think to far. … The laws will be what they are, and we don’t have a say. Our ‘representative legislature’ does. If you care about the legislation, contact YOUR legislators and get them to represent your position, and not just that of special interests.

Whatever the outcome, I will comply as required by law.

Reply
pagel March 18, 2012 8:56 pm

I’m sorry, Marc, but I really have to disagree with your assessment of “SawStop

Reply
- thewoodwhisperer March 19, 2012 7:23 am
  
  You honestly believe that showing pictures of people with severed fingers and keeping a tablesaw injury countdown clock on your home page is NOT fear-mongering? My comment has nothing to do with the politics so let’s set that aside. I guess we have different definitions of fear-mongering.
  
  Reply
  - Paul March 22, 2012 6:48 am
    
    isnt most advertising fear mongering, get the right car so your kids can live? I have a SawStop and I love it, the reason why is the man selling it to me had 3 fingers left on one hand, “i wish i had one of these back in the day”. I think the free market should prevail with out the government coercing manufacturers to make such a system. I love my saw because it is one heck of a saw as well
    
    Reply
  - Bob Natsch August 16, 2012 1:59 pm
    
    Hear! Hear! Fear mongering for profits. If it was all about safety as they want us to believe, they would release the patents. Cheap advertising gimmicks. My father in law was a fine finish carpenter and his hand looked worse than that. Table saw? nope, jointer. Keep up the great work Marc.
    
    Reply
- Vic Hubbard March 19, 2012 10:12 pm
  
  I don’t consider it so much a “sky is falling” issue, as much as a personal responsibility issue that the government shouldn’t get into. I work in the energy efficiency field and still have strong objections to the recent law on efficacy that will ban the manufacture of T12 and 100W incandescent lamps. I’m almost never a fan of the government getting involved in the free market. But, that is just me.
  
  Reply
  - Jason Jones August 17, 2012 9:45 am
    
    I agree with Vic, the real issue is the government interfering with peoples freedom of choice. No one is forcing you to use a table saw, it is your own choice and you’re an idiot if you can’t figure out that a sharp rotating blade that cuts wood can’t do damage to your body. If I had a few thousand dollars extra and the space, I would go out and buy a cabinet table saw. My guess is the politicians pushing this legislation don’t do woodworking and really don’t have any immediate experience with woodcutting.
    
    I have learned ways around woodworking tasks that I would love to have a table saw for i.e. dadoes, tenons, and long miters (Thank you Marc for info and techniques on these). But, I would much rather do it on a good quality cabinet table saw.
    
    Reply
- fransikaner March 21, 2012 8:28 am
  
  I most vehemently disagree on several points.
  
  The present focus is on SS technology and there is a propaganda component that has inflamed TS safety discussions. Marc is most correct in pointing out that SS does not remediate the full range of TS safety issues, and by focusing on flesh-cutting, you have only treated the most visible and avoidable injury.
  
  What folks are not discussing is the downstream effects of federal intervention and its impact on liabilities for ANY professional woodworker.
  
  Insurance carriers will be able to deny/reclaim medical costs and damages for ANY mishap that occurs while employing non-mandated equipment.
  
  If you do not think this is a slippery and hazardous slope for the woodworking industry at large, you have misread where this issue is tracking.
  
  Imagine a day when every wood product on the market required a certification that it was produced employing federally-approved equipment. This does not require legislation. It can be implemented with existing rulemaking authority in the Executive branch.
  
  I do not have a dog in this fight one way or the other at this time, but I shudder to think of a future SS mandate and the wide range of potential future liabilities and mandates that can be introduced into woodworking and foisted upon small business owners.
  
  I do have an interest in properly framed and informed discussion which, I believe, Marc is fostering with this particular article. I have also found that if you ground such discussions in existing law such as our Constitution, you have properly calibrated your arguments for the long and winding journeys that ensue.
  
  All that being said, I started with my Dad’s Rockwell-Delta nearly forty years ago, had one lucky mishap three years later, sold my Unisaw about fifteen years ago, operating on a small Delta tabletop in the interim, and brought back a Jet Contractor into service because I wanted to retighten my tolerances and gain more flexibility.
  
  Through it all, I have found that having two or three different ways to get the job done enriches my woodworking experiences, and a TS in your arsenal never hurts if you use it properly.
  
  Reply
- Arnold March 23, 2012 10:11 am
  
  You just don’t get it. Its not a bash on SS and their technology. It the fact that they are forcing legislation and the known and unknown effects that this entails. I’d tell you a fraction of what will, could happen, but I think my fellow woodworkers are doing a pretty good job with their comments. Think about it, if SS technology is so safe and so good, (which I think it is) Then why don’t they let the customer make that choice for themselves. Many have already done so. As a matter of fact. My next table saw dream / purchase will probably be a Saw Stop, but I totally disagree with the forced legislation for what it will become. So how’s that contradictory for you??? a SS wannabe owner against SS…. They don’t need fear mongering or forced legislation… and I don’t want it either
  
  Reply
VitalBodies March 19, 2012 1:26 am

I could not help but think about this today.

If you do woodworking you have tool up one way or another.
But what if you are not a wood worker, you just do paperwork and sign checks for all the woodworkers on comp and unemployment and the like for those that have been injured? You would likely look at the numbers (the money) going out and have to ask yourself what is cost effective for your state or country. If you saw a solution to even part of the problem you would likely jump on it. I like to try to see things in every way I can. Not taking sides on this, as there are so many ways to look at it.
What came to mind is the whole dang saw is a moot point in terms of cost when there is an injury of note. So, a little technology within the saw, even less. Like it would hardly matter.

A friend of mine snapped his bicep helping to carry a window. He wrote me an email titled “how I spent my vacation – money”. Then noted he had bought a car but this injury was likely to cost “a little less”. You loose a finger or limb or time off work (or whatever) and the cost is high all the sudden.

I keep thinking about Marc’s asking for solutions to common woodworking techniques like rip, miter, dado and such without a table saw.
Nice to stay on that track, not trying to enter a debate. This all just got me thinking.

I have to make a bunch of somewhat large tenons to build garden gate frames. To big for dominoes and biscuits (perhaps) so how to make them? Thought about buying a tenoning jig for the table saw – first thought. Or a tenoning hand saw – second thought or something else unknown – third thought. I want to end up with a mortise and tenon and peg joinery. Well at least that is the best idea so far.

If glue is as strong as wood I can imagine the learn as you go hand saw technique. If it is about perfection of fit I lean towards the jig. But it is almost like superstition rather than science to lean that way. Really, only because I have used the table saw and not the hand saw of that kind for that task.

I will be making three frames, so four times three is 12 tenons. I wish I could look that up on Marc’s site and see the table saw vs the hand saw vs version 3 to help bridge the gap in understanding. But then I think Mateo should grow up too fast and challenge his dad by mastering hand tools (with lot’s video) too.

A show down. Both wearing cowboy outfits.

Am I holding my breathe or what?

Marc also seemed concerned about the band saw not cutting straight. If he is worried I am sweating bullets. My band saw does not cut cedar straight – might need new ceramic blocks. Anyone that would like to suggest solutions for tenon joints like Marc asked I would sure like to hear.

I think most of the challenges can be met with other tools, but the stumper for me a the dado. I wonder if the problem is the tool? If you did not have the table saw you might just build differently and not consider some joinery and do others. But would you?

Reply
Chris March 19, 2012 6:55 am

I grew up using a table saw (quite unsafely I might add) and I enjoy using it. Time is also a factor. I really don’t have time to commit to hand tools exclusively. But I truly enjoy using a table saw, plain and simple.

I own an underpowered Hitachi CF-10 and I plan on upgrading someday to a Sawstop.

Why a Sawstop? It’s a great saw. It is really well designed and has the power I am looking for. I also had my eye on a powermatic for a long time. I own a powermatic bandsaw and a powermatic jointer, both of which I love. I would be very happy with a Powermatic tablesaw. But for me, that fact that the sawstop has an added feature that could save my fingers or someday one of my kids, is important to me. If it was a crappy saw, well that would be another story. But it’s not.

There are so many options for table saws on the market. If you don’t want or need a Sawstop, buy one that meets your needs. As far as the Govt regulations–Yes, stay out of my shop. But in the workplace, it is the whole purpose of OSHA to make sure folks in the workplace have safe working conditions. Whether we think they are overboard or not.

So yes Marc. I love my table saw and everything it can do!

Reply
John Fitz March 19, 2012 7:10 am

Interesting article. I think everything that could be said, has been said regarding the politics of the situation. It will be interesting to see where they set their sights next if they pass this law. Outlaw sharp chisels? require a 50′ clearance zone and an air siren warning when using an air nailer?

As for the TS…I have a SS but I’ll go with the flow on the premise of the article – what to do without it? I guess the first thing I’d have to do would be to open up my wallet to get a track saw, and maybe a domino system, oh and a better miter saw for those cross cuts and bevel cuts (I currently use my miter saw for rough cutting, but all the final cuts are done on my TS).

Probably the thing I would miss most is my cross cut sled. It’s such an easy way to get 90 degree corners, repeatable cuts, and with a good hold-down, trimming a little off small parts (I can’t see accurately trimming a 6″x6″ piece with a track saw system).

Oh – I’d also miss my ability to breathe, because the dust collection on my TS is far superior to that on any of the other systems mentioned. Routers, circ saws, and miter saws are probably the worst when it comes to dust collection.

Reply
Roger March 19, 2012 7:41 am

As far as the SawStop, I believe it should be an available option but not mandated. After watching it in action, I have to wonder, does it ruin blade? They have it installed in the cabinet shop where I work and I have heard they have to change the blade if it does get “sawstopped”. But, they make VERY high end stuff so I was not sure if they change it because they do not tolerate even minor imperfections and don’t want to chance it or, if it actually ruins the blade.

Reply
Ben Daigle March 19, 2012 7:58 am

wow that video is nerve wracking to watch… im glad that i use my splitter every chance i can..

Reply
John Fitz March 19, 2012 8:10 am

Roger, it probably does ruin the blade. Even if the blade is repairable, you would be best to replace it and have the affected blade examined by a repair shop or the manufacturer.

Reply
jim j March 19, 2012 8:10 am

I had my first table saw injury just before Christmas while making doll beds for my twin granddaughters.

I was hit by the board it kicked back at about 100 mph. That piece of plywood hit my left index finger between on the big joint between the top two knuckles. Hurt like hell. Bled like hell. Bone was cracked. Cut very deep but no ligament damage. Ten stitches.

It has been almost 3 months now and the finger still has some pain and still will not straighten out.

Why did this happen to me?? Why didn’t they make this stupid saw safer?? Hmmm. Maybe I should sue!!

I was cutting a thin piece of plywood without the blade guard that came with the Steel City table saw. The blade guard has anti-kickback pawls that absolutely would have prevented it. It also has a splitter.

It was because of kickback, not flesh against the blade.

I’ve been using table saws for 8 years. I knew immediately why it happened. Several factors contributed to it: (1) I was in a hurry because I was really happy how well the construction was going and was pressing hard to get done on time;(2) I had used the saw earlier with my cross cut sled and had to remove the blade guard. I was in too big a hurry. Would have taken a few minutes to re-attach the blade guard; (3) And finally, I was confident I could do the job safely without it since I had done similar things before.

********* I WAS WRONG ***********

I haven’t used my table saw much since then. I am still a bit punchy. Did I mention it hurt like hell??

How could this kind of accident be prevented?
Flesh Eating blade-stop technology would not have stopped it.

Stupid Stop technology, now that might have prevented it.

I will continue to use my table saw, but I have been thinking of ramping up another one of my latent interests: photography. I think it is safer… Of course, there was that one time at the Grand Canyon in 2009 when I was leaning over a rock wall trying to get a better shot of some of those magnificent condors, when I stretched a little too far…

Reply
pagel March 19, 2012 9:21 am

Marc,

I should have been clearer – my bad. Yes it is fear-mongering, but the fear-mongering is occurring on all sides of this issue and the woodworking community has by-and-large ignored its own alarmist rhetoric, not the least of which are vague claims from the power tool industry that retail prices on table saws will become prohibitively expensive if flesh-sensing technology is mandated.

From my understanding, the jump in pricing would have its biggest impact on contractor saws, and to a lesser extent on cabinet saws. But regardless, table saws are not going to disappear because of a requirement for an additional safety device.

There is a long and well-researched history on U.S. regulation and corporate push-back, and this particular regulatory scenario is playing itself out like clockwork. When faced with more stringent safety standards, The trumped-up-doomsday rhetoric by industry rarely happens. They adjust, markets adjust, and consumers adjust.

And with all due respect, Marc, this blog post takes a political stand on this issue whether intended or not. At the very least, the politics cannot be avoided as many of the comments here demonstrate. I’m simply taking a minority position and being critical of the woodworking community more generally for its own fear-mongering.

I do not wish to offend anyone.

Reply
Gary Bell March 19, 2012 9:35 am

Give me a break! This is the stupidest conversation I have ever seen! The problem we have is a problem of “Too Much!” Too much stupidity when it comes to using potentially dangerous shop equipment. Too much talk and not enough education about safe techniques. Too much BLASTED government intervention into our lives!

ALL WOODSHOP EQUIPMENT IS DANGEROUS!

Get rid of all of it and live in a bubble.
Many things in life are dangerous. Cars hurt way more people every year then table saws do. Let

Reply
pagel March 19, 2012 9:50 am

My sincerest apologies to everyone and especially to Marc. In reading through the comments more carefully, I see that there is remarkably little political content in this discussion. I’m jumped the gun and honestly regret bringing the political dimension into this discussion. Shame on me and good y’all. This is a great community and I hope I haven’t permanently alienated myself from you folks.

I’m truly sorry,
pagel

Reply
samg March 19, 2012 11:32 am

Hi Marc, Hi all,

Well i’m actually living without a table saw. I went close to buy one few years ago and the main reason I didn’t is for most task i can’t think about a safe way to do the job on a table saw. I mean really safely.

I can hear some saying i’m a sissy, it’s one thing to be comfortable when working by ourself but can you tell me honestly you would be comfortable watching your child doing things the way you do it ?

As it comes to all the task you mention i’m using a mix of festool system (tracksaw + router with rail) and handtools.

This remind me of an article about handtool vs powertool efficiency :

It sate that fact is handtool woodworkers in 1772 where as efficient than average today’s professional with all the powertools including tablesaw.

And just a last though : sometimes the best/safest/quickest way to do something is finding a way not to have to do it.
You can not do lots of repetitive and precise dados efficiently without a dado stack on a table saw ? Then just design you piece so that you don’t have to do lots of repetitive and precise dados.

Reply
- bob March 20, 2012 7:21 pm
  
  Would I be ok with my child doing what I do with a table saw? Absolutely. Assuming s/he has the same physical abilities. I mean in that — a 10 year old is not tall enough, strong enough, or anything else enough to do what I do on a table saw safely. Same reason we don’t have 10 year old driver license. I don’t what “age” is right, probably different for everyone. Properly trained, and with the right mindset, most 16 year olds are probably good to go. So somewhere in there is the right age for most . . . I know 85 year olds that have been swing on a table saw for many years. All fingers and other parts intact. It is not the tool, it is the user. I am fine with buying a new saw with the latest safety gizmo, and sawstop seems to be one that is very un-obtrusive. But all said and done, you can work on a table saw all your lief, safely, if you know how, and pay attention. As soon as we stop paying attention, skipping the rules, we have problems. The same is true driving a car, flying a plan or any number of things we choose to do. Should everyone use a table saw? Nope. Should we use a table saw for a job when it “feels wrong” — nope. But as with most things it is a good tool for many jobs, and plenty safe if used properly. Bob
  
  Reply
Wayne Wollesen March 19, 2012 1:29 pm

I don’t know that I really have anything new to add here other than I think table saws are hard to beat in terms of accuracy and cleanness of cut vs the time spent. Watching the Roubo build and seeing how quickly Marc does the tenons on the legs with the dado stack, and then comparing that to how long it would take to do them with hand tools and/or some other tool like a band saw or router it’s not even close.

Reply
Dan Drabek March 19, 2012 6:23 pm

I can’t help but wonder why they don’t demand saw-stop technology on lawnmowers. There are certainly more of them in use than home table saws. How often have you seen a barefoot teenager pulling one backwards across a patch of lawn? I looked up the statistics, and there were 406 fatalities in 2005 from using lawn mowers. Between 2004 and 2006, 242.000 americans were sent to emergency rooms with lawnmower-related injuries–mostly amputations. Many of the children. Would you rather loose a hand or a foot? I guess it depends on whether you prefer to play the piano or walk. Maybe lawnmower makers have a stronger lobby. Or maybe a manicured lawn is more fundamentally important than a handmade dining room table. Or maybe table saws are less familiar to the average person and are therefore considered to be more evil.

DD

Reply
- Dave March 20, 2012 8:00 am
  
  You make a good point, one that should scare us all. If they push this stuff through they will continue to look for the next most dangerous product and regulate that, and on and on. The government really should be focusing on more important matters that affect EVERY citizen yet are out of the citizens’ control.
  
  Reply
  - bob March 20, 2012 7:28 pm
    
    The next most dangerous thing? The table saw, as has been noted, is far from the next most dangerous thing, based on number of injuries! The reality is that SawStop has the ear of someone, or enough money to push their technology a long way toward being legally required. Point being, this is not the largest cause of serious injuries, plenty of other dangerous devices exist. My next new table saw may be a SawStop, or one with some similar technology. But to have the gvt require it is very offensive.
    
    Reply
    - Dave March 22, 2012 12:34 pm
      
      I should have said the perceived next most dangerous thing or hot topic of the day.
- Arnold March 23, 2012 10:18 am
  
  Dave, It wouldn’t work on the lawnmower …
  The wet grass would trigger the saw stop lawnmower blades…
  he he ;p
  
  Reply
- Arnold March 23, 2012 10:22 am
  
  Hmm,
  So on your application for home insurance, You selected woodworker…..
  
  [Application Denied]
  
  Don’t believe me…
  ask someone who owns a pool.
  
  That’s where we’re headed…
  
  Reply
Stephen March 19, 2012 8:52 pm

Speaking as someone who has done most of my woodworking without a table saw (couldn’t afford one) I could “live” without one, but I wouldn’t want to. I would do some things with hand tools (tenons probably) but the router and circular saw would probably be my primary work horses.

Reply
Blake March 20, 2012 7:05 am

I can’t stand the fact that one company’s effort to capture a greater market share of the industry has resulted in them trying to legislate implementation of there product. Our society, like so many world wide, was founded on a thirst for freedom not a need for safety. Saw Stop may or may not make a decent machine (they didn’t get a spot in my new shop), but they have no right to try force us to use there technology.

Reply
Brett March 20, 2012 9:03 am

Apart from ripping cuts, a radial arm saw would fit the bill nicely. I learned on one in my shop class many years ago. I have been looking for one for a while now, and unfortunately there are not many on the market. I wonder if we will see a resurgance with all the table saw regulations coming.

I see a lot of comments about hand tools being slower. In some cases they are slower (like breaking down sheet goods), but I have found that for many tasks it is quicker to use a hand saw, plane or chisel than to change a set up on a tablesaw or router. Not to mention the time I have spent making a jig for one or two cuts.

Reply
- Dan Drabek March 20, 2012 3:57 pm
  
  I think many woodworkers consider the radial arm saw to be more dangerous than the table saw.
  
  DD
  
  Reply
  - Chris Wong March 20, 2012 4:02 pm
    
    Dan,
    
    Of those woodworkers who consider a radial arm saw more dangerous than a table saw, how many are proficient with the radial arm and use or have used one that is well-tuned (e.g. without excessive play)?
    
    Chris
    
    Reply
    - Don March 20, 2012 4:51 pm
      
      I lost the end of a finger on a 20″ RAS. I do think you loose focus real easy when doing repetive work. That’s what did it for me nearing the end of a 10 hour shift.
      
      My question is how they (law makers) define tablesaw. I could care less about the little things we use. How are they going to handle the real saws that companies rely on to produce products. I don’t see altendorf and the like bowing to flesh sensing technology.
      
      For me I’m sure I could live without my saw but would have to rely on what I consider more dangerous, the shaper.
      
      Don
    - Chris Wong March 20, 2012 5:31 pm
      
      Don,
      
      Do you feel that R.A.S.s are dangerous? Was it because the saw was dangerous that you lost the end of your finger or because you were tired and losing focus?
      
      Respectfully,
      Chris
    - Don March 20, 2012 5:44 pm
      
      Chris,
      
      I don’t think tools should get the blame period. The ras is such a mindless tool that I think it’s the easiest to tool to loose focus while using. You set up your stops and go about cutting and start thinking about the hot wife at home and before you know it your in the ER. The company I worked for ended up putting a 50 cycle shut down on the ras. So you had to walk over and flip it back on every 50 cycles.
      
      Being human is what gets you hurt.
      
      Don
    - Chris Wong March 20, 2012 5:48 pm
      
      Don,
      
      I agree. The 50-cycle shutdown is an interesting idea. Was it effective?
      
      Chris
Rick March 20, 2012 5:27 pm

Hi i’m from Ireland and are table saws are slightly different in function, dado blades are illegal, as long as you don’t remove the riffing knife (it should never ever be removed when doing any task set it 1 mm below cut depth and it will never inter fear.) my main aspects to H&S with TS is manual handling lifting heavy boards for ripping or 8×4 sheets can be back breaking and we all usually work alone. as mentioned band saw for removing waste router for clean up of joints, and planer to clean up rips works. I think a ts 55 festool can do all the jobs a Table saw can but is a lot cheaper for the accuracy u get and removes heavy lifting through the cut. education is the main issue bring in mandatory 2hour class with every purchase of a table saw education stops accidents.

Reply
Scott March 20, 2012 8:07 pm

The first time I ever heard about a table saw-less shop was when I went to see Roland Johnson at this weather Woodworking Show. He mentioned the dangers of table saws, and stated that most things you can do on a table saw can be done with a band saw, and/or with other much safer alternatives. He even said he was thinking of doing an experiment…basically putting his table saw away for a year to see if he could do without it. It’s an intriguing idea.

Personally, I HATE cutting big pieces of material on my saw (shop is small, so just handling large sheet goods is a pain.) I normally have it rough cut before I bring it home, or cut it up in my garage before lugging to my basement shop. Certainly, having a track saw would make all of this much easier.

However, there are just some things I’d I’d rather do on the table saw…such as joinery for boxes and drawers…bur perhaps this is also due to being a creature of habit as much as anything. However, it is making me rethink my next table saw purchase…since I don’t like using my saw for cutting large pieces, perhaps a high quality portable-type table saw and a separate purchase of a track saw would be the way to go (albeit kind of $$).

Finally…regarding safer saws. I have a 30 year old Craftsman contractor saw. Up until about 5 years ago I NEVER used that saw without the guard for any through cut. Installation of an after market fence has prevented me from using the guard the last few years, but I still get the willies using the saw without the guard, and I’ll either be getting an after-market guard (if I can find one for my saw) or modifying the back rail of the new fence to get it back on.

The guards/splitter/pawl safety devices were a pain to set up and use (which may be why so few people used them), but they did work. And it certainly looks like the riving knife/blade guards of newer saws are much safer. I guess my question is…do these newer (but more conventional) safety features on late model table saws make them as safe (or almost as safe) as saws with the saw-stop type technology? I think that would be an interesting study…

Scott

Reply
Lonnie March 21, 2012 6:44 am

I went “table saw-less” this week and love it. For a very small shop like mine with kids running around the table saw was more trouble than it was worth. The shop is quieter, cleaner, less crowded and even more productive! Being able to move in 190 sq ft really helps!

Reply
don March 21, 2012 8:01 am

I think one thing that is most important in the shop is shop safety. i like the idea of the sawstop and machines like them but let me choose the saw i want not the goverment. There are a lot of accidents with table saws but so are there in everything we do from riding your motorcyle to snowboarding to surfing so and so on we are in a free country and i for one would like it to stay that way. sawstop is selling a tablesaw and safety but at a price. it is cheaper to buy one with out the added feature. if you use all your safety feature that comes with the saw and your SAFETY SMARTs you will never have a problem. i love my tablesaw and i love my handtools also it is just a joy to make something from a pile of wood doent matter to me what i use to get to my end result. it joy in doing,. thanks for letting me rant and may all your shop time be safe

Reply
Mark Arroyo March 21, 2012 3:54 pm

Table saw or no table saw is not the important issue. Do whatever makes you happy and go work wood! The real issue is once again the Government telling people that they need to rescued from themselves. “You are neither capable nor competent to keep yourself safe in your home workshop, WE must tell you how to behave, and what to purchase.” I am waiting for the mandatory lanyard attaching my hammer to my wrist, to prevent me from dropping it on my toe. Sawstop is a great idea for those who want it. I would never buy one out of protest for their actions in this debacle. They are fearmongering and trying to get the government to force me buy their product if I want to own a tablesaw. Not gonna’ happen!

Reply
Billiam March 21, 2012 6:11 pm

Marc, that video link regarding kickback made me jump in my seat. Holy Crap! I’ve never taken my knife off and never will especially after watching that!

Reply
Gilbert March 22, 2012 12:10 pm

I have been struggling with whether or not I wish to add a table saw in my small shop. A table saw has many advantages, but I am unable to dedicate the space to one that would be of reasonable quality. All my tools need to serve double or triple duty which always isn’t the ideal scenario, but we all make due with what we have.

For rip cuts I use a DeWalt TrackSaw, which actually makes really smooth cuts. The problem with the track saw is it is only as accurate as you can mark two lines and accuracy is difficult if the zero clearance strip becomes damaged. The problem is the the workpiece really shouldn’t be much narrower than the track, however I recently saw that Kreg is releasing the “Rip Cut” which connects to existing circular saws and is relatively cheap, so I pre-ordered one. The Kreg solution maxes out at 24″, but should allow for repeatable cuts which would have allowed for better batching of pull out shelves on my last project. For cross cuts of narrow material I use a sliding 10″ compound miter box of course and the track saw for wider projects. Again this may be a place for the rip cut to also help out.

For Dados, as stated, a router works great. Add in the Track attachment, or an edge guide and the router continues to shine. One thing I have done in the past for creating dados is using the track saw in multiple passes with the depth set properly. Then I use a router plane to clean everything up. This may be another place where the Rip Cut may shine to some extent.

I haven’t used tenons in my work, I saw that General had a tenon and mortise jig that uses a router. This probably has limitations but I will explore that further when I decide to dabble with tenons.

Finally miters and bevels I again use the track saw. This works very well for me, but I make sure I have a new edge on the track to limit the potential of 1/16″ variations in my cuts.

Sorry for the long comment, but as a hobbiest all of my wood only tools fit under my dedicated wood bench/ clamping table, and sits next to the wall waiting to be pulled out.

Reply
Mark March 22, 2012 12:27 pm

For the rip cuts you can always rip to near final size and finish it off on the planer which definitely gives you accuracy and as long as your grain isn’t too wild you are going the right directly will take care of the quality aspect too. Of course this assumes your workpiece will fit the max heigh of the planer and isn’t too thin.

For Dados, I’m a big fan of a shop made dado jig and a router. I think you can get better results (quality and accurracy) and can be faster

For Tenons, I use a shop made jig to router the slots in both pieces for a floating tenon.

For bevels, you also have the jointer as an option if you’re not doing end grain or really short pieces.

All that said, you would have a hard time prying the table saw from my hands… maybe even if they were missing a digit or two.

Reply
jHop March 22, 2012 2:57 pm

I’m skipping over the comments due to time constraints (I have a meeting to get to that means i need to leave in about 10 minutes… and the clothes are still in the dryer) but I had one question on this topic that has been niggling in the back of the brain for a few days now.

Can you use a miter saw, compound miter saw, or sliding compound miter saw to replace your table saw? I realize that the width of the board being cut is the determining factor, but how often do we really need that full depth of cut? (As a hobby guy, any way.)

While I cannot argue that a table saw is convenient to have, not every shop utilizes one. For instance, I do not have any location I can leave one. I need to pull my tools out of storage every use, and put them back inside, as my shop is outdoors. Being in the Great Lakes area means I deal with sn… sn…s…. solid precipitation, which is murder on rust preventative techniques. (If they worked so well, my car wouldn’t look the way it does.) And I know I have been very vocal about my shop situation, so I promise this is the last I will bring it up.

personally, I’m looking forward to taking the time later to review these comments, as i’m looking for alternatives to many of the cuts I would normally do on a table saw. Those will have to wait, however, as the uniform is now dry, so I can get to my meeting.

Reply
Douglas Tapking March 23, 2012 4:33 pm

When I was looking for a table saw I heard of the the Saw Stop. What a great idea, but too costly. I bought the sears saw, and learned quickly that precision and quality was not not what I bought. Still could not afford the Saw Stop so I bought a Powermatc 2000 that was on sale. Used it for years with no issues. I SOLD it last year when my Grandchildren really became interested in me. I realized that no mater how careful I am, spinning blades, bits, etc. scare the hell out of me!. I need my hands and fingers, my children need me to have my hands and fingers. I now own a Saw Stop, and hope they expand their line.

My Grandfather lost his fingers in a lawnmower, my neighbor lost his fingers in a “stupid” table saw accident, my turning buddy, just messed up his hand on the lathe. SHIT HAPPENS. I wish my friends owned them.

No I don’t want government regulations, but I do want my fingers, and my ribs. If there is technology that will help then use it. Are you really going to drive without a seat belt or air bags? My son is alive because the belt and bag worked as expected, my high school best friend is not, his car did not have either.

Reply
BoredCutter March 23, 2012 6:16 pm

OK…. As far as the gentleman near the top of these posts (Mike) who feels that woodworking is ‘about the the journey’, not so much the destination…. as soon as you’ve ripped a few 2′-3′ boards of maple, mahogany, teak (or even pine!) in a row (say, maybe just 5 or 6) for even a simple hobby-level project, you might find yourself thinking strongly about ‘thumbing a ride’ and getting on with other things.

I tend to scratch my head when I hear a guy say something like “A {insert type of power tool here} scares the crap out of me, and my spouse hates them even more.” It requires little more than some good common sense and adherence to some tried and true and (in some cases) rather self-evident safety guidelines to be safe around ANY modern power tool, Mike. My wife feels the very same way.

It might interest you to know, I did one of the best things a guy can do to alleviate a loving wife’s fears about any shop power tool: I taught her to use them!!! (Apologies to Slob-Stop and their “worried wife” print-ad campaign….)

Now, we have a schedule on the door to the shop, because she is loving the feeling of accomplishment every time she uses either of our router(s), 3hp Delta UniSaw, 5 hp(!) Grizzly bandsaw, Kapex Mitersaw, Festool Domino or anything else in our shop for a project. I only mention the tools’ names and power ratings to emphasize that while my wife is quite feminine, she does not shy away from any tool in the shop.

It’s the weirdest thing, Mike; it’s almost as if using some intellect, good safety guidelines and common-sense has made government interference almost unnecessary in this arena. Wow…. Weird, Huh?

And by the way – when I said earlier that I scratch my head when I read that type of statement, I can do so with a complete set of 10 fingers even after 7+ years of more than hobby-level work. Of course, I use all 10 digits ONLY if I choose to look like a gorilla. (My wife says that’s all it takes.) :)

Reply
Harold Colvin March 23, 2012 6:28 pm

Like almost everyone else, I have been following the Saw Stop situtation. What I don’t like about the government regulation in this case is that it was the owner of the patent on Saw Stop that asked and is pushing for the requirement for its technology to be installed on table saws. He is also threatening groups developing competing systems with infrignment suits. User safety is not his concern, but developing an income stream for himself.

Not only is there the income from the purchase of new tablesaws, there is the income from a new replacement module each time it is triggered from real and false triggers, the system will be subject to false triggering. After all, according to the drawing with the Canadain patents, the trigger is based on the old touch lamp, which was known to come on all by itself. Then there is the cost of the blade that Saw Stop just ruined.

There is a need for a safety system like this one, but I wish it would be a better one.

Reply
Mike G March 23, 2012 9:52 pm

I couldn’t get along without my tablesaw, so I wil always have one.

I think if a person uses common sense, and proper safety precautions, they shouldn’t have a problem.

We don’t need the government interfering in our lives anymore than they do now.

Reply
Bill G March 25, 2012 6:09 am

Marc,
Giving up my table saw would be difficult. I’ve been working with one for 46 years. I had a couple of kickbacks in the early years which taught me a good and long lasting lesson. I think adding intelligently designed safety devices is a good idea. However, as in many instances, legislating a replacement for “common sense” seldom hits the mark. Quite frankly the best device now required on table saws it the riving knife. It’s the single best safety device on a saw.

If I did have to give up my table saw, however, I would not surrender my Festool track saw and router set up. I can do almost everything my table saw can do with those tools (sometimes better) . This includes the MFT (multi function table) with the cross cut set-up.

Keep up the good work with this site. You’re effort here keep getting better.

Reply
Matt O March 25, 2012 12:23 pm

I imagine a similar conversation to this one taking place when ABS brakes, seatbelts and Airbags where mandated in all vehicles. In fact I remember as a kid hearing my uncle and my dad having this exact argument about ABS breaks and how my uncle swore that it would be over his dead body that he would buy one of those stupid new trucks with ABS breaks; because he new how do drive his truck and was insulted that the gov thought he should have some mandated safety device like all those dumb city folk (he was a farmer) who have no idea how to drive. Guess what, he now has a truck with ABS brakes and Airbags like all the rest of us. At the end of the day why all the fuss? its a safety device that will help to keep your fingers safe, regardless of your skill with the tool.

I don’t think any of you would argue against ABS breaks or Airbags in your vehicle so why the big deal about the sawstop technology?

I purchases a sawstop cabinet saw 2 years ago and I love it. The operation is the same as any other table saw and I have never had the break accidently trigger. in fact I still have the original factory break cartridge in the machine. I think of the sawstop technology just like I do ABS breaks, seatbelts and Airbags in my car. I know its there but I don’t want to every find out if it works! so I practice the same safety measure I would with any other saw!
The main argument every one seems to have against them (besides gov meddling) is that they cost more. which is true, but every new tech always costs more in the start. If they are gov mandated into mass production the costs will come down

Reply
Matt O March 25, 2012 12:25 pm

I can’t see giving up my table saw. I love hand tools but I cannot imaging replacing my table saw especially for big projects and doing all the initial ripping and cross cutting

Reply
Doug I March 26, 2012 4:32 am

Looking on at this Saw Stop shemozzle (Australian slang for debacle) from afar, I really did not think it would have the legs to influence government policy at all. It is certainly not on any horizons here.

But I gotta make a observation. How come in a country that cannot control guns (a tool specifically designed to kill), you are on track to legislatively control table saws (what the???). I suggest the problem there is your politicians need to get their priorities straightened out.

Sawstop is available in Australia now, but I will not be giving up my Cabinet Saw because as pointed out, the biggest danger is kick back and UNTRAINED users. Neither of which will be solved by Saw Stop. In fact, the existence of Saw Stop, could encourage people who otherwise would stay well away to ‘get in and have a go’. When they really shouldn’t. I will be interested to see the statistics on trauma injuries due to kick back in a few years.

Obviously, my knowledge of the events that led to the court case are a bit thin. But, what I remember is; an untrained worker, using a unmaintained piece of crap, with all the safety attachments removed. And they got a successful suit against the manufacturer. What about the employer? The culpability of the manufacturer has to be marginal at best.

Every day should include a good rant, thanks for the opportunity. Hope some one reads it. Happy saw dust making. Remember there is no such thing as a failed project, just fancy fire wood.

Reply
- Lisa August 10, 2012 10:14 pm
  
  Going off of recent news about gun regulation, I think the reason we’re so anti-gun laws is because when the bill of rights was written, the second amendment said you have the right to bear arms, so a lot of people with guns can point to that part of the constitution in defense of their guns. But there isn’t anything saying you have a right to table saws without mandated safety features or anything, so the states can create laws mandating safety features.
  
  I just don’t like that they’re both allowing this to be mandated and patented at the same time. And someone even mentioned competitors trying to create alternatives, but being shut down by the patent holders.
  
  (And ‘fancy firewood’ xD I like it!)
  
  Reply
Hans March 26, 2012 7:44 am

Last November I got rid of my hybrid saw and ready to upgrade with more hp and safety features. I have to admit the table saw scares me as much as a shaper. Even after taking classes in safety I still fear the table saw. After some research and some simple calcs I came to the conclusion Sawstop is a weak band aid solution to fundamentally unsafe design. The Europeans seemed to have picked up on this and we haven’t. Sawstop won’t protect you if your fingers are moving quickly and from what I’ve learned in class most finger-blade interactions happen because of kick back. I decided to get a good bandsaw instead, specifically a PM1800. I will never go back! Drift has never been an issue on this saw and I never needed to adjust the fence. I have ripcuts parallel to less than 0.001″. Kerf marks can easily be cleaned up on the jointer or a handplane. I prefer a couple light passes with a hand plane. I was initially worried it wouldn’t be as accurate but instead I found it’s more accurate. All the other operations I can accomplish with a miter saw, MFT/3 TS55 and Jointer (for long bevels).

Reply
Mariusz March 27, 2012 10:41 am

I’m currently building a set of 14 drawers for my kitchen and up until now I did not used a tablesaw for that project and I don’t plan to. What I use is a Festool MFT/3 with TS55 for making cuts and a Domino for a joinery. I’ve no workshop and having a big table saw is not an option for me. Of course it is possible to live without a table saw and there is a lot of tools that supplement this workhorse. For this ’14 drawers’ project I see that some of the operations would be just faster with a tablesaw. But in terms of mobility and storage Festool is great enough for me.
I’m filming some of the operations and when I manage to finish all of that I’ll share.

Reply
Dale March 27, 2012 5:57 pm

Good grief! The nanny state is, unfortunately, alive and targeting our tablesaws ( for our own good…not). What’s next kitchen knives? Want to bet they cause more in injuries, including murder, than tablesaws.

Reply
Scott March 30, 2012 10:58 am

Very interesting post. I have been using my contractor saw for about 3yrs, and every time I turn it on, I mentally prepare my cut. I believe if all anti-kickback gear is set-up, you drastically reduce chance of kickback. Key is awareness. Some people get too complacent, and that is usually how injury occurs. I am a hybrid woodworker, with a combination of both hand and power tools, but the table saw is a very important tool in my shop. Just need to be super careful, aware, and DON’T remove the anti-kickback gear. It is there for a reason.

Reply
Mike March 31, 2012 9:37 pm

So California is thinking of requiring Saw-Stop on tablesaws sold there. I suppose people can go to neighboring states, buy a tablesaw, bring it home and California misses out on the sales tax. Tax that is going to be paid, just not to CA.
As Jeff Dunham’s Walter would say, “Dumb Ass!”

Reply
Eric Francis April 8, 2012 5:22 am

Just a comment on the proposed mandate for flesh-detecting technology:
Years ago, I was using a sharp butcher knife to separate a stack of frozen hamburger patties. Due to the knife manufacturer’s negligent design, the knife slipped, and I separated my left small finger from the rest of my hand at the first joint. Therefore, I propose legislation to require all knife manufacturers in the US to incorporate flesh detecting technology in all butcher knives sold in the country. That would prevent so many cooking accidents, and after all, if it saves just one finger, it’s all worthwhile, right? I anticipate it would only add $500 to the cost of a butcher knife.
Oh and by the way, I just happen to have a patent on a new butcher knife flesh detector called “StupidStop”.

Reply
John Piwaron April 10, 2012 2:33 pm

ripping – chainsaw. You want to talk about dangerous? That’s it. Mine is in my garage 20 miles away as I write this and it’s scaring me. Maybe we could go way back and use a riving knife and split our boards that way.

dados – the router. It doesn’t get easier than that.

crosscutting – power miter saw. sliding or otherwise. I made a really nice table for mine. It really doesn’t get much easier for me.

tenoning – table saw. Gosh, it’d be hard to not use a TS for that. And I don’t use a dado blade for that. I made my own two jigs long ago to get the cheek and end cuts. Or I could just move to loose tenons. the router is a great tool for making the mortises.

I like the SS. I really do. My only objection is it’s inventor attempting to use the power of the government to make everyone give him money for it’s use. That’s what’s wrong in my opinion. If he’s so worried about my safety, why not release the patent into the public domain?

FWIW, I’m interested in a new TS. And the SS saw is on my list. But so is a Felder/Hammer. And those are higher ’cause I like the sliding table.

Reply
George W April 22, 2012 5:48 pm

I went without a tablesaw for two years. I gave away my craftsman contractor’s saw when I tore down my old garage and built a new and bigger one. I love having a tablesaw now I have a 5 hp unisaw. I never will go without one again.

Reply
Max July 18, 2012 9:11 pm

Seems to me all the machines are safe when you’re paying attention. The real risk is when you have that one time when your brain goes out to lunch. Even for a moment. And don’t think you’re immune to it. Eventually, it happens to us all. I got a nice shot in the gut by a 17″ square shelf that sent me flying back 4 feet. Thank god it hit me in the right spot, because higher or lower and I would have been severely hurt. I was very lucky. Here’s what I know for sure. It is bound to happen again sometime. And Saw Stop would have made no difference.

Reply
Sarit July 27, 2012 11:39 am

I heard a lot of misleading information about sawstop not preventing kickbacks and this is simply not true. Sawstop was one of the first to come out with a riving knife in the US that could be easily changed by hand. Today, Underwriters Laboratories (UL) has mandated that all saws sold now include easy to change riving knives and this has prevented probably more accidents than the flesh sensing technology itself.

Granted the flesh sensing tech does not directly prevent kickbacks, but as you can see in the kickback video, it can greatly minimize the injuries where a part of your body gets pulled into the blade. Just like airbags don’t keep you from getting into an accident, they just reduce the injury associated with them. Airbags also don’t prevent you from getting whiplash which is one of the most common forms of auto injury. Does that mean you don’t want airbags? Who rates a safety device by what it isn’t designed to protect you from? I guess the only safety device that could meet that criteria is a potion of invincibility.

Reply
Bob Natsch August 16, 2012 1:43 pm

The most dangerous tool in the shop is the one that presses the start button on any power tool or picks up a sharp hand tool. I am pretty tired of the general public demanding that the government keep us safe from EVERTHING, and I am one of the few 62 year old “liberal bleeding hearts” out here. I am not an anti-government wing nut knuckle dragger that wants the “gubment” out of my life. Sure it would be a great world if no one ever got hurt from anything, but it just isn’t going to happen. Using a small portable table saw on the floor cutting flooring with no fence or miter gauge FREEHAND is just plain ignorant. Because this untrained and unsupervised individual was injured doing an ignorant task should not dictate that the rest of America be forced to live within the constraints of a proprietory technology which may or may not work for me when the time comes. Come on guys! We unplug our table saws when we change blades because for some reason we do not trust that the mag switch or the plain old on-off switch saw is going to work properly. Why then would you trust a technology that has a far greater chance of failure than a time proven power switch. Hooray for Saw Stop! Their technological advance is amazing. But I think that it just may offer a false sense of security to some folks. I don’t drive a Mercedes or a Volvo or whatever that has umpteen air bags and lane wandering alarms or backup sensors that apply the brakes for you. My F 150 works OK. I suppose I could if I woke up every morning scared s&$#^*ess that today was going to be my last. I trust myself to keep myself safe by trying to practice good judgement in all my daily tasks. This is especially true in the shop. Keep repeating: ” If it doesn’t feel safe, it probably isn’t.” With few exceptions, almost every person injured by a table saw knows what they did wrong. If they don’t, they need waaaay more training. I have a scar on my fat belly from a kickback. I was out of the line of fire, I was using a push stick, my fence was adjusted properly, but my concentration wavered momentarily, AND I was not wearing my leather shop apron. Not a thought of filing some BS lawsuit against someone. Treat the wound, live with the pain, shake it off and learn from it. Life is hard out there. It is time that Americans start taking personal responsibility for their mistakes in life. It is more often our own fault than someone else’s.

Just my humble opinion and rant for the day. I may not be right about everybody, but I’m right about me and a whole lot of you out there; and you know who you are.

Reply
David August 24, 2012 12:46 pm

While we could say that without legislation over time, we would probably not even have riving knives on any table saw (whatever is the cheapest to make, right?), a bit part of the responsibility comes from woodworkers themselves. I’m not even talking about the stupidity of not using the safety equipement and guards that actually come with table saws (I can imagine some “experienced” guys rolling their eyes at that equipment and feeling manly while tossing it in a corner of the shop, bah, I don’t need that cr@p), but also the kind of advice given to inexperienced or beginner woodworkers (of which I am to an extent).

Go through any woodworking forum and you will inevitably find tons of posts from people asking advice and what tool or table saw to buy. And for each one asking about buying this or that new one from a store, there will be 10 guys telling them they should monitor Craig’s List for a used cabinet saw instead. To beginners!

So instead of buying a modern table saw from the store, which will most likely have *modern* security equipment such as quick release riving knife and efficient blade guards and also do the job just right, I should go and buy myself an old thing that has most of the time none of those features (not even mentioning support and warranty), just to have a extra HP or 2 that most people won’t need? A big part of the problem is right there, regardless of the SawStop technology, safety is not yet enough of a concern in the woodworking community and there’s irresponsible advice thrown left and right to people who do not yet have enough experience to know any better. Same way that one might count on their car mechanic to advise them on whether something should be replaced or fix for security reasons or not.

My Ridgid TS works great and smooth, and it’s got an excellent riving knife and guard and that stuff ain’t coming off the saw at any time.

Reply
Don Wight September 11, 2012 7:20 pm

If it wasn’t for the used Ryobi, I wouldn’t be reading these comments. Getting the used tablesaw was the beginning of my adult hobby of woodworking. the Circular saw and jig saw are no match for the tablesaw.

Reply
Sarit September 16, 2012 2:39 am

I think Bob is kinda spinning the issue.
There is a difference between government protecting ppl from everything and government allowing devices with a well documented track record of injuries being released to the public w/o the safety devices that have been proven to seriously cut down on those injuries.

The case I think is bring referred to (Osorio v One World Technologies) has nothing to do with blaming someone else for your injuries. This has everything to do with insurance companies trying to get tool manufacturers to take safety seriously, because they are tired of paying out all that money. Here’s a detail that often gets left out of this discussion:
“in 2006 his insurers filed a lawsuit on his behalf against The Home Depot, the seller of the saw, and One World Technologies”. While it may seem like Osorio is trying to blame the tool company (especially since his name is on the case) you have to realize that insurance companies include in their contracts with you that they have a right to file suits on your behalf to seek compensation for money they paid out for you.

In general, its best to never trust safety equipment. On the other hand, you would be foolish to not have and of them. I hope this logic makes sense for you.

Reply
Joe Dunn 26 September 17, 2012 8:38 pm

I agree with many of the proponents of abandoning power tools and going to strictly hand tools because “it’s the journey not the destination.” Since being suitably inspired, I have given up my car and now walk everywhere because it really is “the journey not the destination.” Being an hour late for work everyday just gave my jerk boss the excuse he was looking for to fire me because he was, at heart, (if you can even call it that) a capitalist pig only interested in exploiting the workers. I don’t think he even cares about the “journey.” Once I realized that I did not need to be a pawn of the system, I joined the Occupy Wall Street movement and learned that the “journey” was all that mattered. I could now live without the exploitation inherent in the corruption of Walmart and the entire “clothing industrial complex” which wouldn’t know a “journey” if they tripped over one. I am currently focusing my creative energies in working to expose the conspiracy of the fascist purveyors of the “indoor plumbing industrial complex.” I will keep you apprised of my progress!

Reply
Doug September 25, 2012 6:43 am

Ok, I’ll jump in. First on the journey or destination thing, isn’t it an individual liberty thing? As a woodworker who uses both hand and power tools I will not criticize another wood worker for his or her choice. If you whittle with a pocket knife or carve out 3D designs with a CNC router, if it relieves stress from this wacky would we live in so be it.
Now as far as table saws go, I can’t imagine doing without mine. However one has to know that it is a potentially dangerous tool. My father who drilled, drilled, drilled safety into me from a small boy, two years ago cut off one figure and part of another on a table saw. So here are a few things that I have either learned the hard way or have put in place after dads accident.
1 Don’t buy a cheap table saw. I started with one of those $100 ones from the big box store. They are light, poorly made the blade will move around on you, the fences are poorly designed. In short they won’t do what you want them to and they will hurt you!
2. I used to get buy with my home made push sticks, after watching Marc’s video on getting a grip I went and purchased a verity of push sticks, grippers and good quality feather boards. What a difference it has made. I have better control, my cuts are better and I’m much safer . Oh and take time to properly adjust your saw!
3. I put rules in place as far as others are concerned. My dads accident happened because something drew his attention away for a second. I have a basement shop with an outside door and a door going into the family room. My saw is on wheels so I set it up so that I am facing the family room door, the other is locked. My family knows that if the saw is running to stop and wait at the door until I shut the saw off. So far so good.
Well I’m sure there’s more I could say but you’ve probably stopped reading already!
Be safe and let the chips fly!
Doug

Reply
Scott October 10, 2012 7:58 am

I currently use both power and hand tools in my shop. However, I am finding myself moving more towards the hand tools when working on a project. I do all of my jointing with my #7 Jointer plane, and all my smoothing is done with various hand planes. I do use my tablesaw for ripping and crosscutting, but I am moving towards hand sawing, so I would say within the next 5yrs, I will be unplugged.

Scott

Reply
steve decker October 19, 2012 9:00 am

Table saws are not unsafe, stupid people using table saws are unsafe! If someone treats the tool with respect they will not get hurt. Respect includes not getting complacent with a saw blade moving at 3000 rpm. This means thinking the cut through and giving it your undivided attention. As far as hand tools, these compliment electric, not replace them. I invite and hand tools only junkie (Rob Cosman) to come to my shop and we can take a long board and see who can get it s4 the fastest. Cmon, think of it! Hand tools are no match for top of the line Delta, Powermatic and Festools. Its like using a revolutionary war rifle compared to a belt fed M240 belt fed machine gun, you are going to get crushed. BUT, hand tools as I said do have their place in finishing work and certain cuts here and there. I have several hand tools from lie nielsen myself.Once again the government seks to protect us from ourselves.

Reply
steve decker October 19, 2012 9:06 am

On a different note, if the government wants to keep us safe, then why does it allow cars (corvettes and vipers) and motorcycles (hyabusa’s) that can go 190 mph out of the box? Oh, I guess they have a bigger lobbying group than the tablesaw industry.

Reply
JG October 31, 2012 2:21 pm

I’ve been avoiding my table saw for a long time, out of safety concern. But in order to do repeatable work, I’m going to have to get started again.

The following Youtube video features the Grip Tite Magnetic Featherboard system, and to my eyes it looks very promising. (This is one of the better videos I’ve come across.) I have NOT tried or even purchased this yet, but I plan to. You all may want to look at it. If you have concerns or ideas to raise, I’d like to hear them.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zR0TkOdsfzk

Also: Anyone have tips for reconditioning equipment that has sat too long in humid Houston conditions? Thanks in advance.

Reply
JG October 31, 2012 2:29 pm

Here is another thought. I’ve tried to use a trim router with a flush-trim router bit as a means of making long cuts that are clean. First I bring the wood close to dimension with a handheld jig saw. Afterward I flush-trim. I like the system from the standpoint of concept and maneuverability. However, I have not had success that is consistent. This lack of success seems mostly due to the low-horse-power trim router.

Next I’ll try this with a router table and more powerful router. This may be less than ideal for long pieces, due to the need to tape a lengthy piece of melamine. But with a large enough feed table and some patience, this does have potential.

Reply
Jonathon December 6, 2012 7:18 pm

After getting a decent table saw last month there is no way I could get used to not having one again. It has definately become the center piece of my shop. Ripping thin stock would be out the window without mine.

Reply
Robert Ouellette January 10, 2013 5:47 pm

Boy, after reading some of the comments ; I’m glad I live in Canada. There they have to sell the product with the safety devises, but it’s up to the owner how they get used. Like Don Wight I own a table saw because of Roybi. I tried it with the guard and anti kick back blade gribs. If you use soft wood the surated anti-kick back guard leaves lines that have to be sanded out. The kick if it occurres on hard wood digs deep knotches into the wood as well as pinch the blade with the wood. An expenive lesson if your buying your hardwood.
So I’ve opt. to remove the guard and anti-kick back. I have found out in the past, if your standing off to the side”Like your subpost to”. instead of behind or in front of your work piece if you get any kick back your not inline for the target. Yes the kick back send the piece of wood or your project fling across the shop or yard, but your still safe if your off to the side of the project.
Nothing can beat the table saw for the types of work it can do as well as for the knowledge you can learn from it. From the novice tablesaw to the professioal, or industrial table saws. Eeryone should know “that the blade is set so that it is only a fraction of the blade that raises above the worked piece”.Rule of thumb is carbed tooth above work surface to create a cleaner and safter cut. If one is right hande they should stand on the left side of the tablesaw to ensure a stable walk and clearance of the work piece. Ones body should never be at a straight angle to the blade or be straight in front nor straight behind the blade. I have had to use a jig saw and an alarm saw ,as well as a reciprocal saw and have tried a chain saw to cut MDFB and plywood. It is easier to set up a table saw and cut or rip down a board or sheet of wood then any other tool that I have tried in the pass.
As for the safety as a flesh sensing guard, I do not understand how a blade spinning at such high revolutions can stop without doing damage. Not to mention, when your cutting wood and happen to cut into your self , the reaction time to it and you tend to stay in motion. You may lift up slightly once you notice what your doing, but it like stubbing your fingers or foot.You still try to finish what you where doing. Well that my two cents on the subject.

Reply
Andrew January 16, 2013 1:13 pm

To cut tenons you could use handsaw for shoulders and band saw for cheeks or this method: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H3VTOpumi58

Reply
- John Zalesak February 19, 2013 5:12 pm
  
  Ok – my first post.
  I have been bumping around woodworking for a few years and I think I am ready to take the plunge and buy some equipment. I was going to buy all used stuff except for 2 items. I wanted a brand new top of the line dust collection system and a 3hp prof saw stop table saw loaded. I have already purchased a used kreg router table/fence, PC router, Dewalt planer and a bunch of clamps. I have a bunch of hand tools – Chop Saw – contractor table saw already. I thought it was time to start saving up for the big two when I ran into this and starting thinking. Here are my 2 options.
  
  Option A (new and delivered):
  Loaded Saw Stop Saw: $3,675
  
  Option B (new and delivered):
  Rikon 10-325 14″ band saw: $950
  Grizzly 18″ helical jointer: $1,450
  Dewalt 12″ Sliding Miter: $540
  Dewalt Track Saw System: $730
  TOTAL FOR OPTION B: $3,670
  
  Not sure what the best option is. I am leaning toward option B. What are your thoughts? (If I get a new table saw – it will be a Saw Stop so you can leave that one alone)
  
  Thanks for your all your comments.
  
  Reply
  - Brent July 6, 2013 3:14 pm
    
    Just sold my sliding tablesaw (had a great offer). Now in the market for a replacement. Tablesaws are of course very dangerous and demand a lot of respect. I’ve been considering a Sawstop or Festool Track saw to replace my table saw.
    
    Reply
  - vin October 30, 2013 6:16 am
    
    Curious as to why you are so scared of the Table Saw, yet no fear of the other 5 danger toys?
    You’d be learning 5 different safety measures, instead of one versitile machine. Of course it all depends on what you are doing. Don’t get me wrong, I use the heck out of my band saw, miter saws, etc. I’m just sayin’ – looks like you have fallen into the scare marketing. Remember that the TS is the most common BIG power tool in American households (most don’t have a large-tabled Bandsaw) and the President of Sawstop is a Lawyer who wants to succeed. If every TS in America was replaced with a Bandsaw, I’m sure the accident rate would go up.
    
    The number 1 Safety tool is your brain!
    
    Reply
    - Kamesh December 9, 2014 6:02 pm
      
      Vin:
      Sometimes the brain doesn’t work on its own volition. My students attest to this condition which I call “Eyes Wide Shut Brain.” TS requires full devotion and no lapses. Anything less is pretty dangerous. With other tools, like BS, CS, or router the risk is very low. If every TS in America is replaced by BS I bet there would be far fewer injuries.
Chet February 21, 2013 7:40 pm

I think everyone is over-reacting.
Table saws aren’t going away any time soon.
Even if the government was to mandate some sort of flesh sensing technology on saws it would add a hundred bucks or so to the price of the saw. I don’t know anyone who’s going to quit using a table saw over that.

I’ve worked with mobile equipment manufacturer’s for more than 20 years and there have been tons of government mandates that were going to “Kill the Industry”. None of them have. The equipment gets a little more expensive and we move on. I remember things being implimented like “driver presence technology” that was supposed to kill the idustry. It didn’t. Redundant steering was going to “kill the industry”. It didn’t. Teir II engines, Teir III engines, Teir IV engines each of these were going to kill the industry. None of them did. You can still get a road roller, an excavator, a tractor, even a concrete buggy. None of those industries were killed by government regulations. At first there’s a cost bump, then as the new technology becomes more common it’s right back to where we were.

I’m the first say we need smaller government not larger. I am NOT in favor of this regulation. But having said that this regulation will NOT spell the demise of the tablesaw. No more than the helmet law spelled the demise of the motorcycle. There will be a temporary bump in cost until enough people start developing technology. Then the price will go right back were it was and all the saws being sold will be safer.

So everyone settle down. Big brother isn’t coming to your house to take away your table saw. They are just thinking about making regulations to force manufacturer’s to impliment technology which will get cheaper over time.

Reply
California Boy May 30, 2013 5:36 pm

I think that a lot of the basic stuff can be done with other power tools (i.e., crosscuts done on the miter saw, or even with a circular saw and one of the readily available saw guides), and ripping can be done on the band saw, with a jig saw, a circ saw, or a hand saw, depending on the size of the stock.

I think where the table saw would be missed is for all those repetitive cuts where jigs are so useful. It will probably take at least a band saw and a router with appropriate jigs and template guides to make up for the same jigs on a table saw.

~~~~

There was a popular mechanics (I think) article a few years back about the upcoming “death” of the bench saw. They basically said that if LITIGATION fears (as opposed to legislation) forced manufacturers to sell table saws that were Saw Stop capable, it would kill about 80% of the table saw market, since 80% of the saws sold are at big box stores for under $150.

good or bad, the complete budget market of saws would be wiped out.

Reply
Steven Jaynes June 13, 2013 11:24 pm

I know this is an old thread, but wanted to comment anyway.

You CAN live without a “real” tablesaw. I worked wood for 20+ years with a Shopsmith. Certainly NOT a true tablesaw, but does table-saw-like operations. They’re Ok for straight cuts and miters but a royal pain for bevels. YET, if I’d had a Festool or Dewalt track saw, I might have continued on with just the Shopsmith. It’s a fine tool, a dandy drill press, an above average lathe, and more. Also has excellent dust collection and a very user friendly blade guard.

All that said, I love my Sawstop 5HP cabinet saw. Rips and crosscuts, bevels and miters, tenons and dados, oh my…

I treat it with respect, with the goal of NEVER having to replace the brake cartridge. BUT if I do, I will be SOOO happy I have one. I have a bad scar on my left index finger from a freak bone-deep cut, that proves that even using MUCH caution and all the safety equipment, things can go bad.

BTW, instead of blaming the saw on the famous Boston lawsuit, I blame the business owner for failing to provide safe procedures for his employees and the operator for being an idiot. Sawstop type equipment should be an OPTION not a law. If a manufacturer wants to produce ONLY equipment with auto-stopping technology, then they will go as the market goes. I do believe you should receive discounts in your commercial insurance if you deploy equipment with flesh-sensing auto-stopping technology.

Reply
Ken August 16, 2013 1:38 pm

Aside from slotting, there’s not much a tablesaw can do significantly better than a bandsaw (as long as you use the right blade, and there’s the rub). And there’s plenty that a bandsaw can do much better than a tablesaw.

I think the main reason that so many woodworkers strongly prefer their tablesaw over a bandsaw for X,Y, or Z boils down to 2 main things. First, the table on a bandsaw is usually smaller than a comparatively priced tablesaw. And second, it takes way, way, longer to change blades on a bandsaw. When you use the wrong blade, the bandsaw can’t compete for straightness and quality of cut surface.

The obvious replacement for a tablesaw is a second bandsaw with a large table, which is dedicated to a carbide resaw blade.

Reply
Frank February 9, 2014 5:35 am

I agree that most table saws are the most dangerous tool in a commonly workshop. But the security is surely only a philosophy matter: finger ever away from the blade area, ideally both hands on two switches like paper-guillotines. So the matter is to have for all cuts jigs that are used from the side of the blade and never require intervention from hand, since “the jig is the hand”. As pianist and organist, I had to re-design my table saw this way. What cant be done this way on the T-saw will not be done on the T-saw. BTW. I mostly cut rough on the T-saw and trim precise with the router. Time intensive but best surfaces.

Reply
Greg Joseph March 6, 2014 7:33 pm

I have a General cabinet makers tablesaw with the full Incra fence which I love. I’ve only had two serious kickbacks in ten years. Both were causes by a momentary lack of concentration and focus. That’s all it takes. Both hit me in the stomach and chest. The last one hit across my chest and bent a large pen I had in my shirt pocket all to hell. I’m lucky it was there. I would have had broken ribs for sure.

I’ve been contemplating going with the Festool track saw system and their table set up. From the demos I’ve seen it appears that this system could take the place of most of the cuts that I use the table saw for. I have a great router table, band saw, dovetail jigs and all the hand tools one could want.
I’d love to hear some comments about ditching the table saw in favor of the Festool tracksaw system.

Thanks.

Reply
Charlie March 21, 2014 5:05 am

I was able to get by without a table saw for quite some time. Even made some decent cabinets for my garage with just a circular saw, miter saw, and a Kreg jig!

Reply
Brad September 16, 2014 5:02 pm

I know a lot of traditionalists roll their eyes at this, but radial arm saws and bandsaws make the table saw a nice-to-have, not a have-to-have. Sure, Craftsman or Power Kraft catered to the price > quality consumers, and covered the RAS sector of the tool industry’s descent into imprecise, poorly-made imports, but Craftsman RAS have probably done more damage to the RAS than any other product line has to any other tool type. I find my ancient DeWalt RASs to be at least as precise and accurate as any table saw I’ve ever used–including a 16″ Tannewitz U. In fact, I’ve never found table saws all that suitable for crosscuts, and while the SCMS is solid, its arbor size, crosscut capacity, power, and often even accuracy leave a fair bit to be desired. A good RAS has the arbor size to swing a big blade with much more power, precision, and accuracy, plus it can handle dado and other accessory operations the SCMS generally cannot. Throw in that it’s on par with table saws for ripping capability, and I’d be quite comfortable without a table saw.

My bandsaw and RAS essentially render the table saw obsolete, at least for my purposes. On the rare occasion I need to cut sheet goods beyond my RAS or bandsaw throat capacity, the old worm-drive circular saw makes its appearance. I’m more hobbyist than professional these days, but even so, I can’t see going back to a serious table saw for anything other than a nostalgic restoration now. The only two I have are a jobsite model and, technically, my Shopsmith, which I’ve only used for drill press and boring (both excellent), lathe (solid), and sanding. I can see why someone who is (1) more comfortable with and accustomed to cabinet saws and (2) regularly working with sheet goods would want to stick with a table saw, but as they say, “different strokes for different folks.”

Chum I’ll throw in the water: what about European-style sliding table saws? Wow. Very different story, really. I’d trade six of my seven RASs plus the bandsaw for one of those.

Reply
Brad September 16, 2014 5:05 pm

Argh. End of the second paragraph should read “Throw in that it’s on par with table saws for ripping safety, and I’d be quite comfortable without a table saw.” Obviously the maximum rip width of a table saw can be much wider than that of a radial arm saw, and could theoretically be as wide as any stock one could find.

Reply
Rodger October 14, 2014 4:17 pm

I have made a full kitchen set of cabinet doors with no more than an 18 volt dewalt set. Some crosscut jigs, and a nice mount to turn the cordless circ saw into a small table saw did the trick. for routing a few hose clamps held the rotozip under a plywood table and the 1/4″ collet held the bits. not easay, not fun, but when your tools are in NY and your mother in law in CA you do what you gotta. Nice thing is a cabinet maker that installed them thought they were shop-made.

Reply
Kamesh December 9, 2014 5:51 pm

Nice post Marc. In my opinion, based on what I have read and seen, TS is a dangerous dangerous tool in the shop even after all precautions and safety measures are followed. Sure you can get hurt with other tools but the risk is very low compared to TS. I own a CS, BS and a couple of routers using which I can do all types of cuts and joints with precision and clean cuts. Unless one is a professional woodworker where time is money, I strongly believe that most amateur woodworkers can get by without a TS.

Reply
Steve Irby January 15, 2015 8:21 am

I just dont touch the blade. For those who do touch the blade, blame the blade toucher. Good Lord. Saw Stop, from an engineers point of view, is great. I saw a live demonstration in New Orleans in ’05 and thought it was real cool. But I will not buy one even on the cheap if they are trying to lobby to get laws passed.
Tangent about GM and other American companies kindly not added.

Reply
Brian May 3, 2015 8:51 pm

Cutting up sheet goods – quality circular saw and shooter board. I have shooter boards made from 3/8″ aluminum bar stock with threaded holes every foot. I screw on some 1/4″ plywood, run my blade down the board and I’ve got a direct-measuring fence. Very accurate. Much more so than a wiggly table saw. If you do this, make your aluminum bar 104″ long to give you 4″ of overhang on each end for starting and ending the cut. The bar comes in 20′ sections at the local metal yard, so cut another one 56″ for a 48″ shooter board for crosscuts on the plywood. Safe the rest of the aluminum. You’ll find uses for it. They make pretty rugged straightedges if you do construction work. I’ve made very good quality cabinet carcasses with my shooter boards.

Ripping – most ripping I do is non-critical and I do it on the radial saw. Yep, it rips just fine unless you’re a dufus. But it does leave saw marks on the side, so if the ripped side is going to show you need to leave a sixteenth and pass it through the router table to clean it up. Some ripping I do on the bandsaw. Mostly deeper cuts. You can saw up some pretty substantial or pretty funny shaped logs on a bandsaw. I’ve also cut blanks for mandolin bridges on mine, though they obviously require some hand work afterwards.

Crosscuts – you say the table saw is king? You’ve apparently never used a radial saw. I’ve got mine on an old HTC stand with built-in infeed-outfeed roller tables so I can rip or crosscut pretty long stock in complete safety. (Too bad: I don’t think they make those stands anymore.) You can easily crosscut miters, bevels, compound. I have made tenons using a dado set and just chewing my way around them, though they take a little cleanup afterwards. The table saw might be better at this.

Crosscut accuracy is achieved by pulling the blade slightly over the work and measuring directly to a tooth on the blade. (Pay attention, the teeth alternate sides.) This gives you accuracy to the middle of the mark on your ruler or tape if you are careful.

Repeat crosscuts are very simple: measure your first cut, slide a stop up to the end of the piece and use a spring clamp to stick the stop to the fence. Use two clamps if you are doing more than a couple of cuts, just to make sure the stop doesn’t creep. (It really won’t with two clamps.) A stop is usually just a piece of 1×2 with a corner knocked off for sawdust relief. Then just butt each piece against the stop and cut. This is very quick and easy to setup and is great for production. You can do similar things with a sled on a table saw, but I can make my fence as long as I want and clamp on stops anywhere along it.

Dados – lengthwise I use the router table, cross-cutting I use the radial saw.

Radial Arm Saw safety – People who think these are more dangerous than a table saw simply haven’t used them enough to be credible. I adjust the hold-down and anti-kickback pawls and make sure the splitter is down in the kerf for every rip cut. For really narrow rips I setup a temporary hold-down with scrap wood and a clamp. Nothing has ever shot out of the back of my saw while ripping since 1978. And I spent some years using it almost every day. Crosscutting: I have had the saw jump up onto a board and damage the wood and force me to check the adjustment a few times in the 37 years I’ve owned my radial saw. But then I learned about reverse hook blades. Use them for crosscutting and your radial saw becomes completely tame. One nice thing about a radial saw is that you can see the blade while crosscutting and it is very easy to keep your fingers out from in front of it. People who have never used a radial saw think that big blade hanging up there in space is scary. But you can stand in front of the radial saw with your weight safely placed above your feet, the workpiece does not move and you just pull the saw through it. That is much safer than crosscutting on a table saw where the blade is mostly hidden from view and you are leaning over the table in a less than optimally balanced position and pushing the work through the blade and possibly your fingers along with it. I’d much rather pull the visible blade through the work, fully supported on its nice ball bearings than push an awkward (miter gauge) or heavy piece (or a heavy sled) through the blade. It is a lot safer.

Reply
Rick September 2, 2015 5:55 pm

bit dumb to put the “Don’t tread on me” in your table saw report
Government says put on your seat belt…I put it on bc it well save my ass

Reply
Paul November 24, 2015 2:01 pm

I have a table saw and like having it around. But I confess that having a small shop makes it more of a challenge to use. I have my hybrid setup on a gravity rise stand and I don’t use it often.

Instead, I have an older beaver that I use for rough rips and crosscutting. But for most of my rips, a shooting board with a nice blade gives me great cuts and is really quick to setup. Repeat cuts are about 60 seconds longer than for a table saw, since I use a marking guide set to the original measurement and bob’s your uncle!

I have a radial saw and agree that for smaller and repeated crosscuts, it rules supreme for me. Super stable workpiece and my -5 blade makes climbing nonexistent. I don’t rip on it, mostly because it takes a lot longer than just setting up the shooting board. But it only does 14″, whereas my table saw sled does 26 x 35″. and that length could be extended some, so there’s that to consider.

I use hand tools for some things and the router for others.

In other words, find which setup works for you and run with it. I use whatever tool I can to make my life easier and make projects end up cleaner. If my shop setup or type of projects change, then my tooling probably will too.

Reply
Brian Sommers July 29, 2016 1:06 pm

I’m going to find out shortly what life without a table saw is like.
I just sold my TS, BS, SS, DP, MS, Planner and I’m going traditional.

Reply
Stephen Powell June 22, 2017 12:44 pm

After 10 years of woodworking consistently I, unfortunately, lost my pinky, ring, and middle finger on the table saw. Cut along the PIP knuckle (first knuckles from your palm), and 3 replant surgeries didn’t work even with one of the top 10 hand surgeons in the country doing my surgeries (the saw cut and ripped them off in less than a second). I’m not scared of the tablesaw even after my accident but it is neat to see alternatives that I overlooked because the tablesaw is just so efficient at performing many tasks within a project.

Reply
jon April 24, 2018 11:12 pm

If “they” ban table saws I’ll cook my own meth.

Drill a couple holes in the plate of a circular saw then cone them out with a countersink so a fluted bolt will hold it perfectly flush, then use t nuts or threaded inserts in the work bench to mount and dismount the inverted saw.

Obviously this is more dangerous than a commercially made table saw

Reply
Swing June 11, 2018 6:39 am

I have a very small shop 12 x 20. have on one wall 3 Dewalts. One is a GWI (10″) one is a 1030 (10″) and one is huge 5hp single phase GE (16″) long arm that will do 29″ on the outrip! I am finding i just dont have room for my table saw with a band saw and jointer and thickness planner. I have done lots of ripping and use tcg blades on my RAS saws. my GE is designed for a 16″ blade but use it as a dado saw.
All three of these solid cast machines cost me a total of 450 canuckastan dollars. Remember if you are willing to learn how to set these old cast machines up the will stay true and serve you well. I like table saws but for me the RAS is a better fit and allows me more floor space in my small shop.

Reply
Adam smith June 19, 2018 10:40 pm

“I do have an interest in properly framed and informed discussion which, I believe, Marc is fostering with this particular article.”
This is true and I love the way you explained everything like cut, rips, cross cut etc. Really informative post.

Thank for good post. waiting for more about wood cutting.

Reply
Thomas July 16, 2018 10:45 am

First, let me thank everyone for their experience and educated comments concerning your preference about having a table saw in your accumulation of woodworking tools. In the past I had an inexpensive Craftsman table saw that the motor eventually burned out, consequently I’ve been in the market for a more substantial table saw. I’ve been looking for something that will provide me with an ergonomic design concerning the overall layout and manipulation of the various features of the saw, as well as flexibility of use of the basic features and the availability for growth, and last but not least the quality and reliability of service.
I’m a 65 year old DIYer and have a limited amount of space in my two car garage. Though I truly enjoy woodworking as I can see all of you do, I’m admittedly a novice in the craft at best. Even in my youth, it was challenging to rip a 4×8 sheet of plywood on a 10” table saw and feel confident about my safety and the quality of outcome about the accuracy of the cut. Now that I’m 65, it’s even more challenging. Also I realize there are larger table saws to be purchased but it appears most if not all of your big box stores and specialty woodworking stores only carry the 10” saws. Let’s face it, you can get yourself into enough trouble with a 10” table saw and I suppose for most, anything bigger would be gross over kill.
I’m providing you with some background in order hopefully receive some insightful advice. While shopping for a table saw I have come across a system that seems to be a viable alternative to the majority of the criteria I have set for the right saw. Have any of you ever seen or heard of the Pro-cut 50 manufactured by Toronto Tool Manufacturer Inc.? It’s an apparatus independently utilizing a hand held power saw and/or router for what appears to be the majority of applications I have read about in your comments. Though it also appears the owner of the company has retired and this particular apparatus is no longer in production. Obviously that in itself creates a bit of a dilemma.
Have any of you in your consideration of eliminating or replacing your table saw ever been introduced to this particular apparatus and if so what were your thoughts concerning it? If you haven’t seen it, and if you’re so inclined, simply search for Pro –cut 50 on the internet and you should be able find it.
This is where I’m asking for your opinion:
1. Do I give in to the conventional decision of many and purchase a table saw that will undoubtedly provide me with years of service, yet do what I consider only one thing well, rip a manageable size piece of wood or
2. While I’m in the market and have the availability to rethink how I want to and am physically able to do things in the future, do I venture out into the unconventional way of approaching woodworking (as it appears some of you have already done) and begin to adapt my approach with some sort of system or apparatus (I may in up having to build) that will possibly help me to enjoy woodworking for many years to come?
3. I realize there are other means of accomplishing these tasks as mentioned by the author of this well written article, I’m just posting possibly a different alternative that hasn’t yet been considered.

I promise, my comments about this apparatus are not meant as any sort of an endorsement, recommendation or advertisement. They are merely intended as observation of a YouTube video seen on the internet.

Thank you very much and happy woodworking,

Reply
Jarom June 14, 2020 2:56 pm

Back in early 2018, as a senior in high school, I was working on my table saw. I needed to cut a 1inch by 1inch square to finish a project. So after I cut down the 1inch wide 6inch long piece I got ready to cut the square. Using a push stick for the 1inch between the fence and the blade, I held onto the 5ish inch scrap outside the blade with my hand. I was nearly through the piece when it kicked the scrap out and my left hand took the place. Luckily I didn’t loose any fingers, but the injury was pretty decent only requiring a few stitches.
But since then I haven’t been able to use the table saw since. I still want to wood work, but even when I had a new blade, sled with clap system, and any other safety system I could install (no sawstop). When I turned on the saw to cut a 1 foot by 3 foot board I panicked so much I had to turn it off and go inside.
I can use other power tools like a chop saw, band saw, and hand held circular saw. So reading this helped me realize I have more options available to me than just a table saw. Thank you.

Reply

Cookie	Duration	Description
cookielawinfo-checbox-analytics	11 months	This cookie is set by GDPR Cookie Consent plugin. The cookie is used to store the user consent for the cookies in the category "Analytics".
cookielawinfo-checbox-functional	11 months	The cookie is set by GDPR cookie consent to record the user consent for the cookies in the category "Functional".
cookielawinfo-checbox-others	11 months	This cookie is set by GDPR Cookie Consent plugin. The cookie is used to store the user consent for the cookies in the category "Other.
cookielawinfo-checkbox-necessary	11 months	This cookie is set by GDPR Cookie Consent plugin. The cookies is used to store the user consent for the cookies in the category "Necessary".
cookielawinfo-checkbox-performance	11 months	This cookie is set by GDPR Cookie Consent plugin. The cookie is used to store the user consent for the cookies in the category "Performance".
viewed_cookie_policy	11 months	The cookie is set by the GDPR Cookie Consent plugin and is used to store whether or not user has consented to the use of cookies. It does not store any personal data.