Jointmaker Pro – From Bridge City Tool Works
It isn’t often that a new tool comes along and stirs things up in the woodworking world (the Domino and Steel City’s granite offerings come to mind as recent examples). So I always get excited when I see an invention or innovation that makes us question the way we do things in our shops. If that item happens to be viewed as “expensive”, you have a formula for controversy, intrigue, and heated debate (well, at least the woodworking version of such things).
Now I may be late to the game with this, but I just read a blog post over at Popular Woodworking that featured the Jointmaker Pro from Bridge City Tool Works. And if I missed it, chances are many of you missed it. Now, if you aren’t familiar, Bridge city is a manufacturer of uber-fine-quality hand tools. Their latest offering is called the Jointmaker Pro, and the concept is simple: it’s a stationary handsaw. Check out the video below to see it in action. It looks like the unit will retail for $1295.
So I started watching the video yesterday and I found myself giggling. And I am still not 100% sure why. I think that part of the reason is because its one of those things that makes you do a virtual double take. Maybe a “wha wha what?!?!” moment. I envision hand tool zealots everywhere saying, “DOES NOT COMPUTE!” Its no secret that using hand tools properly requires practice, patience, and finesse on the part of the user. And in order to reap the rewards of the tool, you need to “pay your dues” by learning and practicing. Power tools, in most cases, are more or less plug and play devices and require less precision from the user (pardon the generalization). But a device like the Jointmaker gives you all the benefits of a handsaw (and then some), while managing to remove much of the human element. This makes the concept hard to swallow and even more difficult to digest. I am still wrestling with it in my brain and trying to figure out where this tool fits inside our woodworking universe. Truthfully, at nearly $1300, I imagine its going to be a hard sell for most folks. But its an interesting innovation, nonetheless, and provides us with a very cool discussion topic.
So what do you think? Is it deserving of the hype? Is it worth $1300? Will the woefully uncoordinated among us now be able to produce a comparable or better set of hand cut dovetails than a seasoned pro? Me thinks, perhaps, the answer is yes.
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I like to be open minded and optomistic when it comes to new tools. And I understand new products are priced high to recoup R&D and tooling expenses. But golly, $1,295 for this tool is a tough pill to swallow.
Is it supposed to be better than a router and an Omnijig, for example? Or, is it intended to be a very expensive non-electric solution?
Right now, I’m thinking the Jointmaker Pro falls into the “For the man who already has everything else” category.
This was posted on Lumberjocks a few days back and I saw it then. I watched the video again just now on your site and I am still dumbfounded. This is so cool, yet could be so uneccessary that I have to have it. I’m still undecided and am glad to see that it is out of stock on the Bridge City site so that I am not tempted on some dark night to impulse buy along with all my Ronco dehydrators and super slicers.
I think this will be unparalleled in the small piece work like mouldings. Dovetails could be cool, but I would like to see how long it would really take to cut a full set from start to finish. You still have to chisel out the waste and such so I am not sold on that application. However, my toolishness is getting the better of me and it is just so cool. $1300 is going to keep my impulse buy in check for a while anyway.
At first glance I sort of chuckled at what appeared to be a machine with a lack of guts and a large price tag. Then I watched the video… now I must have it! The precision for small/detailed projects is very appealing…. it does look like it would be fairly simple to create your own poor mans version (albeit, a less robust product than Bridge City). But it appears to be simple table, simple fence, and a fixed japanese saw pitched up. The raising/lowering mechanism would be a tough rig… in any event… I agree, this is mind-changing product… is a machine or is it a handtool???
So cool…so expensive…really small carbon footprint.
That’s CHEATING!!!
I must have one.
man…a cool, and very innovative device for sure….something about it though really creeps me out as far as finger safety (although I know a 3HP cabinet saw should be more scary….maybe the Jointmaker just seems so unnatural vs. what we’re used to). Hey – maybe SawStop should make a Japanese Jointmaker!
Now lets see who will be the first to come up with a homemade version. Hopefully that person will post plans so we can all benefit!
When are you getting yours Marc?
That really is a neat little tool- I want one. Sure I might not use it that often, but at this point that can be said for all of my tools. Marc- when do we get to see you review one?
This machine looks awesome. Too bad it’s so darned expensive. Considering what’s in it, maybe $400 would be a reasonable price point, but more than 3 times that number? I don’t think I will be getting one any time soon.
Re: finger safety. Anything that can cut wood like that surely would cut fingers before you even realize what’s going on. So while it’s a bit better than a table saw (e.g. no kickback!), I don’t think it’s harmless.
I saw it demonstrated by John at at MASW weekend with him and Tom Lie-Nielson and Chris Schwarz. It was for sure amazing to see. Looked like it would be perfect for model makers and apartment dwellers. John said it would be on sale initially for a lower price, we’ll see if that holds. Also a video was being produced for it.
Ryan
Ultimately demand will dictate the price, but what a cool idea. I need to watch the video another 5 to 10 times to see if it is something I could actually create on my own. The premise seems simple enough. Plus, for that price, I want to see those gears be stainless steel. Call them and get one to review!
Agree with Vic, for the price nylon gears doesn’t quite seem right. Are there positive stops for setting miters (I see stops for setting the bevel of the blade)? I don’t even see the miter gauge… for precision and repeatability I assume they’re integrated in there but just not shown on the video. Again for the price, I would expect that in this tool.
I haven’t seen the video that was posted demonstrating the jointmaker yet, but when I saw John demonstrate it at Jeff Miller’s shop back in April I was amazed at the idea. And then when I heard the price tag I was even more amazed.
I have to give it to John for being on the cutting edge (forgive the pun), his tools aren’t just innovative but beautiful too. While I don’t think the jointmaker will replace anyone’s power saws, the cut was smooth and effortless and the surface left by the cuts was glass smooth!!
Amazingly, by the end of the tool demo that saturday I heard he had sold 3 of the units already!!
very nice concept, and like John, I can’t wait to see the home made jig version. However, there is nothing about that contraption that makes it worth the price tag to me. It’s rediculous, frankly, to charge that much, despite it’s capability.
It does inspire me to sharpen my hand saw skills, so I can say “yeah, but I can do that with my own two hands and a $60 Japanese saw.”
Super cool.
My question is this: what about maintenance and durability?
The first thing I thought after I picked my jaw up off the desktop and started thinking again was: How often am I going to have to change the blade on it?
The second thing I thought was: what about larger pieces? All the demo pieces seemed relatively small, like moldings and small intricate pieces to be applied to larger pieces.
And I’m on board with the comments that $1,300 seems high.
Truly an interesting product.
Reading the Bridge City website, I was thinking this thing would be a hokey, useless gimick. After watching the video, I am quite intrigued. The price is way too steep, so I also would like to see how long before someone comes up with a homemade substitute. My attraction to it was the repeatability of small scale cuts done safely.
Basically, after you cut through all the marketing hype, you get down to a device that seperates wood fibers and the extent to which the device does so with consideration given to the ease and precision in which that task is accomplished. So if you mount a Japanese saw upside down in a fixed and locked position at an angle (to compensate for the hand thrust with normal use) and you use a sliding bread board with a fence you can accomplish the same thing. Just a variation (albeit an expensive one) on the same old theme. Device to cut wood fibers.
John Economaki, founder of Bridge City Tool Works stated in a Q and A on the “Popular Woodworking” site when a comment was made as to the price:
“As you know, prices often start north of center and over time migrate south. We have done our best to bring this tool in where it is. FYI; there are 35 lbs of aluminum in this tool which is now pushing $3.50/pound. Add in 60 CNC set-ups and milling time and it adds up fast. Our first prototypes used 18 ball bearings–they are awesome but would retail for $1900 and that is just not going to cut it (pun intended…).”
Could’nt they have just used 35 pounds of pot metal and saved alot of money?
As much as I like seeing innovation, and I do, there’s nothing like using hand tools to accomplish the same cuts as this machine does.
I could see how this tool would benefit musical instrument makers and anyone doing fine molding work though.
I worry about the nylon gears used on this tool. Brass, or metal gears would last much longer. If a small piece of some hardwood lodged in one of the teeth, it could break one of the gears teeth.
I think for the high price of this tool. I’ll stick to using good old-fashioned hand tools instead.
I love to see out-of-the-scrapbin thinking like this and the Sawstop. Truly new thinking instead of how to make something the same old way and just put new polish on it. I get tired of what passes as “innovation” in the woodworking field. For example, a bigger “Off” button on a table saw is not innovation. It seems like the louder minority in the woodworking industry is set in it’s ways and slowing down new thinking/techniques with their “this is how we have done it, so this is the way it should be done” thinking. John Economaki – of Bride City Toolworks – writes about it in his blogPlease Meet the “Woodworking Talibanâ€.
As to the price, it is ungodly high, but so is all of Bridge City’s stuff. If you are looking at what they are selling, you know what you are getting into. I have a couple of things from them – on the lower price end of course – and I’ve never seen anything put together any better then what they produce.
Tool looks really neat. But I am surprised at all the gripes about the cost. I guess if it’s made in America, it’s supposed to be cheap? But that doesn’t explain why America drools over everything European and doesn’t complain about their inflated prices. Oh well.
Roland, a specious argument at best. I don’t see where geography came into the equation until your post. If this was made outside the US I don’t believe anyone would be commenting differently. People are not looking for it to be “cheap” but hopefully somewhere near reasonable given the simple materials and relatively simple design of the machine.
I think most of us realize that Bridge City’s business model is not based on reasonably-priced tools sold at volume. They go for lower volume with a higher profit margin and cater to a certain demographic (i.e. not the common woodworker). Personally, I don’t begrudge them that. They build superior tools and that is how they choose to market their brand. At the same time when we see a unique tool like this that we all want (and most of us can’t afford and/or justify at the price) we need to grip about the ridiculous price mostly as a form of therapy. At least I need to… OK, I’ll get off the couch now.
I’m a skeptic. The tool is obviously superb for certain specialized tasks like cutting shoji screens or other sorts of intricate fine work. I could also see coveting it if you were a patternmaker and generally working to a minimum of 1/64″ precision (there are, what, three of these folks left?). I certainly can’t cut that precisely with a hand saw. But ultimately it’s a tool that cuts wood, and wood swells and shrinks and warps and splits and does its own damn thing without your input. Why attempt precision you cannot maintain, even if you do everything utterly perfectly?
now thats cool! i wonder, should i get that or a cabinet saw? i think that its a cool tool but i can’t see spending that much money when i could get at least a hybrid saw with 2 hp, and a 50″ fence for about as much, or less in some cases.
But does it make french fries?
Very neat idea, for specialist tasks.
When I made a handle for my old brass-backed saw, to cut the int ital slot for the blade, accurately and central, I fixed the saw on its side, to a flat surface. Cramped it down at the right height and pushed the handle along the blade until the slot was cut. it wasn’t as quick as this sawing jig, but it worked. Now I wish I had ‘thunked outer the box’ and developed the procedure!
I would like one of these, but not at the price.
JW
“I think most of us realize that Bridge City’s business model”. From the posts here, it sounds like alot of people don’t. Even as a fellow Oregonian, I’m not sure what their customer base is. I thought it was well to-do collectors that bought their fancy planes, and purchasers for 50th-Anniversary trophy things; you know, the woodworking equivalent of the gold watch.
But this gadget doesn’t fill that model. The silly music had me smirking, too. What was I thinking? “Finally! Power Tools for the Amish!”. ;)
I’m impressed. This gadget cuts on the push stroke, not the pull stroke. I guess that’s because it’s upside down??
Let’s see – Hybrid table saw $1200, 220 volt circuit $300+, dust collector $300, eye-ear-face-lung protection $100, accessories for accuracy $400, mobile base $200. Did I leave out anything?
I’ll wait until the price moves south a bit, but this is one very attractive tool, even though it won’t rip to the middle of a sheet of plywood.
Yes, it is a high price. The only thing that I would be concerned about if I was Bridge City would be that if everyone waits for a lower price, and therefore nothing gets sold, there goes the balll game.
I would think they would be better off selling a certain number of units for considerably less, getting the buzz going, then make the price reasonable when the ‘good word’ starts to get around.
If everyone waits for ‘the next guy’ to buy it, nobody buys it, that ain’t good for business.
What’s a reasonable price? Good question. If I saw it for $650 and had seen other people I know using it and liking it, I might well get on board. To buy it when all I’ve heard about it is ‘Johhny saw it at a show and he thought it was great’, no. That leap of faith I reserve for tools that are under $100, maybe.
I just got around to seeing this video on the capabilities of this unit. Looks so cool, and easy to get precision accuracy I believe that it probably could be worth the money.
I’m looking to take the serious plunge into woodworking, and my biggest struggle to date is what is the best tool to produce all the joints necessary for furniture? For most items, I see this replacing the tenoning and dovetail jig. There alone is close to 450 bucks for decent equipment? I’m sure it has the abilty to do much more also – who doesn’t need sponge wood?
Still, as I sit here and wipe the drool from my chin, I still don’t have the answer. Lately, there seems to be so many innovations in joint making including the Domino, Woodrat and now the JointMaker Pro…
Be careful about falling into the trap of buying a bunch of fancy tools. It seems like most of us that have been doing this for many years can share our experience (and emptier pocket book) from buying fancy tools. Think about it like Golf or Photography? Did people ask Ansel Adams what camera he used?
Practice with a handsaw(I think Japanese saws are the easiest to master) cutting some joints. Take your time, don’t force the saw and practice making cuts. Our own hands are incredibly flexible tools in themselves. Don’t jump down the power tool route. Start out with hand tools and go to electric from there. Your work will be more creative, and your designs will not be limited by the limitation of the power tools.
Both have there place, but build your skills and have fun!
In reading all of your comments, I have little to add. I too, am going thru in my mind how to create my own version, for pennies on the dollar, if possible.
It is a very intriguing tool. I would put it outside of “hand tool” AND outside of “power tool.” So what is it? I don’t know. Hand powered, with a power tool price tag. Maybe a “green” table saw.
What ever you want to call it, I’d take a free trial offer, but like most, I’ll only be able to watch the videos for now.
I am too cheap to buy a good bow saw. I love tools, I prefer to make them myself. I saw the tool in person in Austin at the LN Tool Event.
I looked at it and saw several things that I could not possibly do without it. I came up with several other things I could do especially well with it. Then I considered what it would take to make it myself. I looked closely at the machine. I decided that the cost of it was less than my cost to make one. With one odd possible exception. Using it, I might be able to make a copy out of wood in reasonable time and at reasonable expense. Without it, forget about it.
I examined it further, considering the dust, safety, and noise. I considered what I could do easily with it and reduce my error and my waste.
I bought one. I hope it ships soon!
Bob
Fabulous concept. Love the small kerf and, given a sharp blade, it’s doubtless an enjoyable tool to use.
But, of course, there’s a lot this tool won’t do: Chief among them a rip cut of any sort. Even in crosscutting, you’re bringing the wood to the tool, not tool to wood. That sort of cutting action will get perilous very quickly as the stock length increases.
So? Has anyone built a jig based on the Jointmaker concept? Has Bob Strawn got his?
Sadly it has not shipped yet. I plan to make a few simple projects and then start on the jigs.
Bob
Gotta admit, I was fascinated. When I saw the price, I was turned off. I can build a REALLY NICE router table for that kind of money, AND outfit it with a NEW router.
I have a well-tuned Sears contractor 10″ saw, with zero-clearance inserts. None of the cuts made on the video(except those TINY spacers in a stack) were any more difficult to do on my Craftsman, especially with my “saved for the best” Forrest blade that’s always kept sharp. Yes, you’d have to discount the blade width, but how often do I need a 3/32 kerf? If I were to make the often-planned crosscut sled, these cuts would be even easier, INCLUDING the spacers.
Jointmaker’s cute, it’s gutsy, and it’s innovative. But I’m so comfortable with my table saw I don’t think I’d want to spend the time learning the new tool, not without some outstanding benefit (outside the 220VAC deletion). At $200 plus my OWN SAW, I could see it as a bench tool I’d use twice or three times a month, but it would not replace anything in my shop. Actually, if I bought it, I’d be spending valuable time trying to come up with tasks to use it. At that price. What’s the point? KP:
I have mine and it’s working. Tough job building it. Lots of fine tuning. Lots of lube points. It works really nice but there is a learning curve. As with any new tool, practice improves quality. I can see blades being damaged easily as I damaged my first one. The thin teeth bend if you have a slight mishap as I did. If even one tooth is off, the whole thing is cutting bad. If the alignment is off, forget it. This must be absolutly square and everything in order. Then it works really well.
Blair Glenn
My first exposure to the JMP was at a MASW class in ‘08 that John Economaki taught. My initial reaction was, “Well, ain’t that cute!” Then I had a chance to play with it. My second reaction was, “I gotta have one of these!” Then the videos started showing up on various websites and providing even more ideas. I ordered one!
I took mine to John’s class at MASW last month where we spent five days learning more about it. It can be a little fussy to adjust at times, but it provides accuracy that I had no idea was possible when working with wood. I wouldn’t sell mine at twice the price… well maybe I would if I were sure that I could get another one right away.
Nobody was ever sorry that they bought the best!
WDS
Very cool, but ultimately will become a niche tool.
Well it was good to read Blair Green’s post above – someone who actually has one and is using it. I am surprised that in addition to paying $1200, you have to build the durn thing too!
The nylon gears aren’t working for me – they are not rugged enough to justify the price. Well actually nothing on this tool does enough to justify the price to me.
The commentary at the top of the page says that power tools allow the user to use less precision. That is nonsense. They just make the same precision easier to achieve. This tool is a nice idea, but not at this price.
I think you may have misread my comment. I didn’t say power tools cause the user to be less precise, I said they require less precision from the user. Two very different things. The point can be illustrated with a simple dovetail joint. Set up a jig correctly and anyone with a router, two hands and an electrical outlet can make a decent dovetail joint. Cutting that joint with a saw and chisels, on the other hand, requires much more in the way of manual dexterity from the user.
This a conceptual game changer. Like art, this device is creating a Great dialog about design, use, skill, craftsmanship, economics and long held ides.
I would venture to guess that many people who see the video ask themselves “why not?”. When you produce tools like bctw it’s not just about the function of the tool. It’s also about spirit and purpose.
I have no intention of buying one of these. But, I know next time I’m at the bench I’ll be asking myself, “are there any ideas in that tool’s design that I can use to improve my work.” then I’ll pick up my saw. I’ve gotten the bennefit of some new thinking, and BCTW gave me that for FREE
They have sold out of their first production run. My thought is that this would be a great basis for an apartment workshop. Provided you have an extra room in your apartment.